Quick note: wouldn't you rather run Chesto Berry to ensure that Diancie will be able to wake up from Rest immediately and simultaneously ridding itself from any possible status instead of burning it's item on something like a paralysis? It would be unfortunate for the Diancie user to see its wake up tool get used when it wasn't planned at that moment.Diancie @ Lum Berry
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Diamond Storm
- Stealth Rock
- Rest
- Moonblast
With this set, Diancie doesn't even care about anything Talonflame does and can hit it very hard even when burned (although Lum Berry can alleviate this once)
0 Atk burned Diancie Diamond Storm vs. 252 HP / 8 Def Talonflame: 284-336 (78.8 - 93.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO. (If Talonflame Bulks Up, it is still OHKOed by DS. Even if Talonflame Bulks Up and burns Diancie, it has a high chance of being 2HKOed (0 Atk burned Diancie Diamond Storm vs. +1 252 HP / 8 Def Talonflame: 188-224 (52.2 - 62.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO -> This will kill after factoring in the first hit)
It also punishes Kyurem-B who switches in freely with Diamond Storm or Moonblast. Earth Power only has a low chance to 2HKO without Stealth Rock. Rest is there to provide recovery and prevents it from being worn down too easily. Stealth Rock is there because Diancie easily sets it up with its bulk
Well, Zapdos can Toxic it, but that is pretty much it. Zapdos was chosen because Talonflame was a more immediate threat (Talonflame beat everyone else 1v1), but this pick has to be a reliable way to deal with Deo-D that can also set rocks.not that I havae been participating, so sorry for just butting in, but what are you guys going to do about deoxys-D?
no no no, I mean deoxys-d is banned now, so do you still keep it or what?Well, Zapdos can Toxic it, but that is pretty much it. Zapdos was chosen because Talonflame was a more immediate threat (Talonflame beat everyone else 1v1), but this pick has to be a reliable way to deal with Deo-D that can also set rocks.
We still keep it. We can't undo 2 picks. It's kind of like how the Deos are legal in the mini tour, because they were legal when it started.no no no, I mean deoxys-d is banned now, so do you still keep it or what?
A stealth rock setter is pretty much mandatory.So, obviously the goal now is to have another pokemon that can help against Talonflame and Deo-D and has defensive synergy with the rest of the team. Thundrus (TBolt, TWave, HP Ice/Incinerate, Taunt) does the first two, but then Team 1 would be able to pick someone like AV TTar which would wreck pretty hard. I think this is the wrong direction to go though because defensive synergy should be the priority for the last pick. On that note, what about Clefable (Calm Mind, Flamethrower, Moonblast, Softboiled)? Solid defensive player that can easily become an offensive power if brought in at the right time, or if her counters have been eliminated. Alternating Softboiled and Calm Mind after dangerous physical attackers have been dealt with is often a route to victory for my team, though Team 1 is mostly physical attackers, so maybe a physical wall would be better, but then, we have Zapdos for that already.
What are people's thoughts? Just kind of throwing out musings.
I like the idea, but there are a few things that you should notice.Ok so I'm retaking my Special Ttar idea now as a nomination.
Tyranitar @ Expert Belt
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 20 HP / 252 SpA / 236 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Hidden Power [Rock]
- Fire Blast
- Stealth Rock
It basically deals with Deo D, Ferro and Talonflame while nothing on Team 2 can safely switch into without risking losing 50% HP. Spd EVs are enough to outspeed Deo-D; otherwise, Modest with 184 spd for Kyurem-B and leftovers would be better. Please note that this guy is not taking hits from anything outside Talonflame as it is not a tank set, we need Dragonair for Landorus, Scizor for Kyurem B if over 50% health and Zapdos for random physical attack.
Now you may have noticed that the usual Sandstorm has been changed to Unnerve, why? well I don't want Team 2 losing more health than they should everytime they are on the field and I don't want a random Sandrush Excadril pick on Team 1 to suddenly outspeed and OHKO all our pokes. Honestly, sandstorm would only be useful for dealing with Kyurem-B 1 vs 1 as of now.
Offense
252 SpA Expert Belt Tyranitar Hidden Power Rock vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Kyurem-B: 209-247 (46 - 54.4%) -- 6.3% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Expert Belt Tyranitar Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Ferrothorn: 302-360 (85.7 - 102.2%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO (OHKO if switches into any attack and SR before Fire Blast)
252 SpA Expert Belt Tyranitar Hidden Power Rock vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 518-610 (143.8 - 169.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Tyranitar Hidden Power Rock vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Landorus: 96-114 (30 - 35.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock (on switch)
Defense
252+ Atk Sharp Beak Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 20 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 87-102 (25.1 - 29.4%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252+ SpA Teravolt Kyurem-B Earth Power vs. 20 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar: 204-242 (58.9 - 69.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 Atk Ferrothorn Power Whip vs. 20 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 228-270 (65.8 - 78%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (f**king Fire Blast better hit)
EDIT: Just to clarify, I'm chosing Satk over Atk so Ttar can better deal with Team 1 even with a burn. Physcal Ttar would struggle against Deo-D if it gets burn for wathever reason and if facing Ferro 1vs1 there is a much higher risk of getting hit by Power Whip and losing its Talonflame counter status.
EDIT: Why not use Ancient Power? It's completely legal because it gets Dark Pulse and Fire Blast through TM's and SR and AP from Tyrantrum.Ok so I'm retaking my Special Ttar idea now as a nomination.
Tyranitar @ Expert Belt
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 20 HP / 252 SpA / 236 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dark Pulse
- Hidden Power [Rock]
- Fire Blast
- Stealth Rock
It basically deals with Deo D, Ferro and Talonflame while nothing on Team 2 can safely switch into without risking losing 50% HP. Spd EVs are enough to outspeed Deo-D; otherwise, Modest with 184 spd for Kyurem-B and leftovers would be better. Please note that this guy is not taking hits from anything outside Talonflame as it is not a tank set, we need Dragonair for Landorus, Scizor for Kyurem B if over 50% health and Zapdos for random physical attack.
Now you may have noticed that the usual Sandstorm has been changed to Unnerve, why? well I don't want Team 2 losing more health than they should everytime they are on the field and I don't want a random Sandrush Excadril pick on Team 1 to suddenly outspeed and OHKO all our pokes. Honestly, sandstorm would only be useful for dealing with Kyurem-B 1 vs 1 as of now.
Offense
252 SpA Expert Belt Tyranitar Hidden Power Rock vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Kyurem-B: 209-247 (46 - 54.4%) -- 6.3% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Expert Belt Tyranitar Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Ferrothorn: 302-360 (85.7 - 102.2%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO (OHKO if switches into any attack and SR before Fire Blast)
252 SpA Expert Belt Tyranitar Hidden Power Rock vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Talonflame: 518-610 (143.8 - 169.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Tyranitar Hidden Power Rock vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Landorus: 96-114 (30 - 35.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock (on switch)
Defense
252+ Atk Sharp Beak Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 20 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 87-102 (25.1 - 29.4%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252+ SpA Teravolt Kyurem-B Earth Power vs. 20 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar: 204-242 (58.9 - 69.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 Atk Ferrothorn Power Whip vs. 20 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 228-270 (65.8 - 78%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (f**king Fire Blast better hit)
EDIT: Just to clarify, I'm chosing Satk over Atk so Ttar can better deal with Team 1 even with a burn. Physcal Ttar would struggle against Deo-D if it gets burn for wathever reason and if facing Ferro 1vs1 there is a much higher risk of getting hit by Power Whip and losing its Talonflame counter status.
I switched to your EVs spread, it basically hits like a truck but the only relevant new calcs are against Kyurem and Lando on the switch.I like the idea, but there are a few things that you should notice.
1) Hidden Power Rock requires a suboptimal IV spread. More specifically, an even IV for Speed. You also can outspeed this Deo-D with a Modest nature. I think the best spread would be
EVs: 12 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 240 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 30 HP / 0 Atk / 30 SpD / 30 Spe
I wasn't looking for the best scenario but for the worst, as Team 1 wouldn't switch Lando if they predict Dark Pulse over HP Rock/Ancient Power and nothing else really wants to switch.2)Why are you calcing Hidden Power Rock on a Timid Lando-I? The calc should be: 252+ SpA Tyranitar Dark Pulse vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Landorus: 156-184 (48.9 - 57.6%) -- 96.1% chance to 2HKO. You should also update the other calcs to include a Modest nature.
Switched HP Rock for Ancient Power and crossing fingers for a +1 in all stats.I personally don't think it's a risk, but others may think otherwise.
Added calcs using your black list. Azumarril and Gyarados beat this Ttar set no matter what, the rest of the guys can't switch into Ttar and have a good chances of getting OHKO after SR.EDIT: As far as Megas we might have to fear, Gyarados, Charizard X, and Aerodactyl are the 3 I noticed that currently put us into a world of hurt. After a boost, at least 4 members of our team get OHKO'd and they all either already outspeed or will after a +1 boost. All three of these pokemon are weak to SR in their base forms so that makes it an even bigger priority to choose a mon with Stealth Rock this round, but it cannot be weak to either of these 3 pokemon either.
I personally don't think it's a risk, but others may think otherwise. And yes, if there is a pokemon out there that beats all 6 members of Team 2, Team 1 can afford to screw over their SR weak pokemon to secure a victory if all its last pokemon needs is a free switch in.Quick answears, will fully edit later.
I used the ps damage thingy and I can't recall if Deo D has timid for default which is why I run timid aswell, will change to your spread.
Hp rock so we dont get pp stall with ancient power, unless you guys think it's not a risk.
Scizor beats Azu and sets up, also can team 1 afford not having a spinner with talonflame and Kyurem?
Although Landorus T is generally great to get rocks on the field, I think this set is quite hard to play as Explosion is a 1 way ticket to hell and exploding on the wrong pokemon (or in a random protect from Team 1 last member) could put Team 2 in a bad situation. Also Deo D could just recover the damage, making Lando suicide attack a vain sacrifice or leaving the team open for a sweep from one of the pokemons G-Von mentioned.I'm seeing M-Blastoise or Healing Wish Latias as good contenders for the final Team 1 slot, but G-Von is right in saying Team 1 could easily forgo hazard removal if there's an easy win button instead. Here are some Rocks setters I've been brainstorming with the aforementioned threats in mind:
- Unaware Clefable
- Taunt Mew
- Sticky Web Shuckle
- Magic Bounce Mega Diancie
Feel free to suggest one of those guys, because my nomination this round is going to be:
Landorus-Therian (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 80 HP / 252 Atk / 176 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Explosion
I really don't like bulky pivot Lando-T because he's predictable & easy to wear down. It's easy to forget that this guy has a whopping 145 Base Attack that rarely gets utilized to its full potential. The idea is to get up Rocks obviously & spam U-Turn alongside Greninja & 'nape. Once Ferrothorn is out (who incidentally gets 2HKOd by LO Earthquake... holy shit) take the opportunity to Explode on anything for an absolutely absurd amount of damage & bring in the next guy for free.
252+ Atk Life Orb Landorus-T Explosion vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Kyurem-B: 420-495 (92.5 - 109%)
252+ Atk Life Orb Landorus-T Explosion vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Deoxys-D: 220-259 (72.3 - 85.1%)
252+ Atk Life Orb Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Ferrothorn: 200-238 (56.8 - 67.6%) -- the second EQ still kills if LO was Knock'd Off
252+ Atk Life Orb burned Landorus-T Explosion vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 278-328 (77.4 - 91.3%)
252+ Atk Life Orb burned Landorus-T Explosion vs. +1 248 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 186-218 (51.8 - 60.7%)
The speed is to outrun an Adamant Gyarados, which is definitely a huge threat.
Stone Edge is an option over Explosion... probably a smart option... makes for a safer answer to Talonflame (this one can't switch in to Talon), but can't threaten Deo-D in the same way. Explosion was also to one-shot opposing M-Blastoise, Intimidate Gyara, things like that.