Other XY OU Pokemon of the Week #8: Hippowdon

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Hey guys, TRC. with Magnemite here bringing everyone the next Pokemon of the Week!

The XY OU Pokemon of the Week is an (obviously) weekly project in the Overused forum. The idea originated from when we were reading many of the discussion threads, often the discussion is a bit lacking in the content department. Our goal here to is to highlight a threat in the metagame that isn't as well known, or isn't used as much as it should be, and provide a concise amount of information about that Pokemon; this will encourage creativity during teambuilding, and it will also provide an instant wealth of knowledge about that particular threat. This will hopefully be more helpful to the massive influx of new players in the OU subforum and promote better discussion within the individual threads. In this thread though, the main point of discussion should be about experiences with that particular Pokemon and the sets featured, and how it has helped in some way during your battling. Niche sets and gimmicks can be mentioned as well, but bear in mind that this thread is mainly an informative source of knowledge through what is written in the OP; discussion is not its main focus, though it is most certainly allowed. we need to make this point clear. Think of this like an article introducing you to a new threat that you can use; and try it out! Oh yeah, you can also VM one of us what you think the next POTW should be, bearing in mind that they will be on lesser-used threats, such as Chesnaught, Krookodile, or Cofagrigus.

Remember, in order to be Pokemon of the Week, a Pokemon must be in a tier below OU (Including BL), based on the new 1760 stats.

This week's Pokemon of the Week is Hippowdon.


Art by The (phenomenal)Mega Lotad.

Type: Ground
Base Stats: 108 HP / 112 Atk / 118 Def / 68 SpA / 72 SpD / 47 Spe
Ability: Sand Stream / Sand Force
Introduction
Hippowdon is one of the best walls in OU. It is almost impossible to break through physically, but it also is decently specially bulky with investment. This makes Hippowdon as effective a special wall as it is a mixed wall. It has reliable recovery in the form of Slack Off, and this in combination with its bulk allows it to check some of the most common Pokemon in the game, including Mega Charizard Y, Garchomp, Excadrill, and Talonflame. It also has the rare Sand Stream ability, which is excellent as the sand wears down the opponents team, benefits teammates such as Excadrill and Mega Garchomp, and boosts the Special Defense of Rock-types by 50%. It has has a decent Attack stat, which means it is not total Taunt bait.

Its Speed is very low though, at a sluggish base 47. It also has weaknesses to the common Ice- and Water-types, which plague OU as offensive coverage, especially on special attacker which aim to prey on Hippowdon's weaker defensive stat. Without a specific move in the final slot, Hippowdon has trouble with a different amount of Pokemon, which means there will always be a group of Pokemon that it can't deal with. If it chooses to run Rock Slide, then it has no way of preventing opponents from setting up on it, if they resist its attacking moves. With Toxic, Poison- and Steel-types can setup on Hippowdon. With Whirlwind, it can't wear down attackers as easily.

What to try:

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off
- Toxic / Rock Slide / Whirlwind

Hippowdon has a great Defense stat, so when it invests in Special Defense, it becomes an excellent mixed wall. It can wall a variety of special threats, most notably Mega Charizard Y, which has no form of offense against it aside from Solarbeam, which leaves it vulnerable to Rock Slide from Hippowdon during the charge turn which is created when Hippowdon switches in and generates the sand. Hippowdon uses Earthquake to give it some sort of offensive presence, which is actually quite powerful coming from Hippowdon's decent Attack stat. It is especially useful for Aegislash, which makes Hippowdon one of the best Aegislash checks. Hippowdon can learn Stealth Rock, which is an essential move for every team, so it is no surprise that it is on the set. Slack Off is great, as it allows Hippowdon to recover lost health, which often makes it impossible to be broken by some attackers. Toxic is the most preferable option in the final slot, as it allows Hippowdon to wear down Pokemon through passive damage. Rock Slide is an option to take down Mega Charizard Y without resorting to Toxic stalling. Finally, you can use Whirlwind to phaze out setup sweepers and rack up entry hazard damage on the foes team. The EVs are quite simple: they make Hippowdon as specially defensive as possible, the Careful nature serves the same purpose.


Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Force / Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic / Whirlwind

While the other set is a great mixed wall, this set is purely physically defensive, which allows it wall a variety of common Pokemon including Garchomp, Talonflame, and Excadrill. The choices of moves are very similar to the first set: Earthquake is a STAB move and hits Excadrill hard, Stealth Rock is obligatory support for any team, and works well with Whirlwind, Slack Off allows Hippowdon to actually be used as a wall, as it can recover off lost damage chipped away by physical attackers, and then the final slot is a toss-up between Toxic and Whirlwind. Toxic cripples defensive Pokemon and allows Hippowdon to stall out foes, while Whirlwind allows Hippowdon to phaze setup sweepers and rack up Stealth Rock damage. The EV spread and nature maximize physical defense as would be expected, and Leftovers provides passive recovery. Unlike the first set which requires Sand Stream to check Mega Charizard Y, Sand Force is an option here, as it means that Hippowdon can still wall foes, but teammates don't suffer from sandstorm damage.

What else can you try?
There are few other options for Hippowdon. One could use an offensive Sand Force set with support from Tyranitar, but it sacrifices Hippowdon's natural walling capabilities, and Hippowdon is slow enough to be revenge killed by a multitude of attackers. Ice Fang allows Hippowdon to KO Garchomp easier, but it really isn't necessary with the combination of Toxic + Slack Off. Finally, Hippowdon can use a Smooth Rock so that its and lasts longer; this lets it support Pokemon that use sand for an offensive benefit, such as Excadrill, Stoutland, or Mega Garchomp.

Good Partners for this Pokemon:
On stall teams, great teammates are ones that fit into the standard stall mold, such as Mega Venusaur, Clefable, Quagsire, and Blissey. A combination of defensive threats like this allow the team as a whole to wall a variety of attackers in the OU metagame. On balanced teams, Pokemon such as Mega Garchomp and Excadrill benefit from the sand to sweep foes. Latias is a good partner as it takes on Keldeo, which can be a thorn in the side of Hippowdon. Rotom-W can switch into the Water- and Ice-attacks that trouble Hippowdon and maintain momentum with Volt Switch.

Playing against Hippowdon: Checks and Counters
The best counter for Hippowdon is Xatu, as it can bounce back all of Hippowdon's supportive moves and it is immune to Earthquake. Toxic and Taunt users such as Gliscor, Chansey, and Thundurus can either cripple Hippowdon or limit it from using its essential moves. Special attackers such as Keldeo, Greninja, Rotom-W, Starmie, and Celebi can all hit Hippowdon with their powerful super effective STAB attacks. Mega Venusaur walls it and can use Leech Seed, while Gyarados and Breloom can set up and beat it 1v1.

There we go, that's the fifth Pokemon of the Week! Let us know whether this has helped you at all, and your results of testing these Hippowdon sets on the ladder. Also, don't forget to let us know via VM what Pokemon you want to see next. All opinions are welcome, as well as opinions about the Pokemon of the Week format and any ideas you want to see implemented, as well as questions for us about either Hippowdon or POTW itself. Go out there and try Hippowdon now, and we'll see you next time!

 
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Just a nitpick, but the heading of the Checks and Counters section still says "Playing Against Manaphy".

Still can't believe Hippowdon isn't OU, it's just so good.
 
Hippowdon has become the go to physical wall for me. His ability to handle physical threats like talonflame, garchomp, conkeldurr, and even +1 char x and +2 bisharp makes him an amazing physical wall, and a huge help for all the physically frail, and rock weak sweepers available.
 
Hippowdon is one of the most underrated mons. It can check many big threats in the current meta like mega-zard x, mega-mawile, the birds and many other threats. It is the 2nd best mixed wall after chansey imo. I think a mixed set should be in op.

Hippowdon (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 240 HP / 192 Def / 76 SDef
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Slack Off

the special defense evs allows you to take 2 shadow balls from quite aegislash.
 
I think Charzard-Y could also go under the good teammate section. Besides having good defensive synergy with charzard-Y and providing stealth rock support, sandstorm actually helps charzard out by canceling out sun. This ensures that Charzard-Y will always have a full 5 turns of sun whenever it switches in.
 
Hippowdon's raw bulk really is impressive, but there are a few reasons I often prefer Gliscor.

The first one is Hippo's susceptibility to status. Toxic is the death of him, and WoW is pretty damn bad as well. Rotom-W is such bad news for this guy, especially when at best if you run Toxic and Rotom uses ChestoRest after WoW or Hydro Pump, or worse, Tricks you a scarf. Gliscor's Poison Heal is a godsend of an ability. Despite having less overall bulk, the constant regeneration on top of immunity to other statuses and better defensive typing allows for far more switch in opportunities. Gliscor also does not fear Knock Off once Poison Heal activates, whereas Hippo's walling potential is really hampered when he loses Leftovers. Because of his low speed he can get worn down not being able to Slack Off and Whirlwind fast enough to keep out HO threats. Gliscor heals passively through Protect and prevents further damage for goes for the gusto and Roosts. Hippo's ability also had the potential to be useless if not detrimental to your team, which is why some people go so far as to use Sand Force instead to not invoke sand.

That being said, Hippo really is quite a bit bulkier than Gliscor. 108/118/72 vs 75/125/75 doesn't sound like much but that HP speaks for itself. Gliscor's typing mitigates this somewhat, giving added immunity to Ground on top of Fighting and Bug resists and losing his Grass weakness so he has better switch in opportunities on top of status immunity. But Gliscor's recovery options are far superior coupled with his speed. So Hippo can take raw hits far better, Gliscor is better at recovery through Poison Heal, Substitute, Protect and Roost. I think this is why teams need to prepare for Gliscor sooner than Hippo because outside of fast and strong special Water/Ice moves, it's really hard to take Gliscor down if you don't have the right moves or can get stalled by his Toxic, which Hippo sometimes can't do.

Hippo's attack is also quite a bit better at 112 compared to Gliscor's 95, meaning his unboosted Earthquakes hurt quite a bit more. Gliscor also doesn't get access to a good Rock or Ice move like Hippo, and can't abuse his Flying STAB with Acrobatics unless you sacrifice a slot for Fling, or switch into a Knock Off.

After using both, Gliscor has suited me better overall as a bulky Ground type. I often find when I used Hippo I had 4MSS that I never seemed to have the right move for many circumstances.

Also don't forget Skarmory as a counter, who you'd need Thunder Fang for do do any decent damage, and Skarmory is immune to Toxic while being able to Toxic you, Taunt and stack hazards. Also if you only carry one attacking move then Air Balloon Heatran ironically walls you making you unable to pop its balloon, forced to Whirlwind as it Toxic or Lava Plumes. Choice Specs Latios is also immune to EQ and wins with Surf. Sheer Force Lando-I also does 70-83% with Earth Power if you're not specially defensive.
 

Trainer Au

Insert custom title here
Shouldn't Ice Fang be slashed somewhere, or is that not an option anymore?
Generally dropped in favour of the other 4 slot moves.

Whirlwind is important to stop: bulky sd sciz, np thund, conk, mpinsir, etc.
Toxic is nice to punish switch-ins from: politoed, quag, rotom w, etc.

It also cuts the survivability of defoggers like lati@s and mandibuzz.

Lastly, rock slide hits mpinsir, zardy, talonflame, etc
 
The best counter for Hippowdon is Xatu, as it can bounce back all of Hippowdon's supportive moves and it is immune to Earthquake.
No, it's not. Xatu can't do anything back, and a lot of Hippowdown's run Ice Fang or Rock Slide.
 
No, it's not. Xatu can't do anything back, and a lot of Hippowdown's run Ice Fang or Rock Slide.
Xatu can Toxic Hippowdon and wear it down with Night Shade while Roosting off the damage from its Rock Slides, which can't 2HKO even when Xatu is Flying-type, and obviously it is just Psychic-type while it Roosts. Meanwhile, Ice Fang should work similarly except it is an unviable option on Hippowdon.
 
One thing that is worth mentioning about Hippo is how effective mixed EV spreads can be. It has such a great overall bulk that its possible to tweak its defensive capabilities exactly the way you want them to by reaching several benchmarks. For example, on my hippo I invested enough in special bulk to savely check non LO Aegisslash and to survive a fireblast in the sun from Mega Charizard Y while putting the rest into def. The amount of SpD is also enough to take <50% from most HP ice users and to take a Draco Meteor from Latios while using Slack off without losing to much life as a result. With the Crumbler Set declining in usage I dont see much use for full SpD investment.
 
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Hippowdon: 214-253 (50.9 - 60.2%) -- 89.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 160 Def Hippowdon: 187-222 (44.5 - 52.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 Atk Hippowdon Rock Slide vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Pinsir: 204-244 (75 - 89.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage

Just leaving that there. If you're using the hippo as your physical wall, you may want to run 160 Def EVs to always check Jolly M-Pinsir. Unless you're running a Rotom-W or defensive Aegislash with your Hippowdon, you may leave your team vulnerable to M-Pinsir if Hippowdon is your dedicated wall.
 

Rotosect

Banned deucer.
I find Sand Stream to be a liability on Hippowdown now so I usually run Sand Force instead.
This is because most teams that require Hippo's support usually run pokemon vulnerable to passive damage such as Thundurus and Kyurem, who certainly don't appreciate the sandstorm.
If I'm running a sand team I see little reason for using Hippo over Tyranitar.
 
I find Sand Stream to be a liability on Hippowdown now so I usually run Sand Force instead.
This is because most teams that require Hippo's support usually run pokemon vulnerable to passive damage such as Thundurus and Kyurem, who certainly don't appreciate the sandstorm.
If I'm running a sand team I see little reason for using Hippo over Tyranitar.
Then why not just use both? You have a dedicated Wall to set up sand along side Pokémon who generally uses sand to beef up its Sp. Def and attacks anything in sight. Sure if ya want damage over taking hits with recovery, then that's good, but I just know that double Sand was a very fun strategy to abuse and still can be.
 
The only reason to run Sand Force on a defensive set is to not detract from Venusaur's Synthesis, right? Or is there another element that I'm missing?
 
The only reason to run Sand Force on a defensive set is to not detract from Venusaur's Synthesis, right? Or is there another element that I'm missing?
Its in general better to use Sand Force when the rest of your team doesnt like the sandstorm dmg. Many offensive mons dont appreciate the dmg every turn, especialy mons with life orb, that passive dmg stacks quickly. Not interfereing with Synthesis/moonlight is a important factor but not the only one.
 
Even without Sand Stream Sdef Hippo can take a hit from Zardy and kill it with Rockslide/Stone Edge so no, its not losing without Sand Stream but it cant switch into it anymore. However even with Sand Stream switching into Zardy isnt always possible because Zardy has to be in his mega form already. If you switch in Hippo and Zardy evolves afterwards the sun is back and you are screwed so abusing Sand Stream here is somewhat tricky. Imo thats more like an emergency button than a solid solution, i wouldnt rely on it.
 
cutting mega venusaurs recovery in half on a 8pp move shouldn't be underestimated, against stall teams clever use of sand can be v. important

and also agreeing with above, you cant switch in on an unevolved zardy at all, only if something dies (you should be revenging in this case) and only if you have a decent amount of sp def plus rock slide (which alot of hippos dont)

the hippo is for sure underrated right now though, it really is fantastic as a pivot in ou atm
 

Andrew

beep boop
is a Top Artist Alumnus
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Hippowdon: 214-253 (50.9 - 60.2%) -- 89.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 160 Def Hippowdon: 187-222 (44.5 - 52.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 Atk Hippowdon Rock Slide vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Pinsir: 204-244 (75 - 89.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage

Just leaving that there. If you're using the hippo as your physical wall, you may want to run 160 Def EVs to always check Jolly M-Pinsir. Unless you're running a Rotom-W or defensive Aegislash with your Hippowdon, you may leave your team vulnerable to M-Pinsir if Hippowdon is your dedicated wall.
I'd like to add on to this by showing calcs relating to a:
EV's : 252 HP / 168 Def / 88 SpD
Careful Nature
Mixed Hippo Spread with regards to both M-Pinsir and Char Y:

252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 168 Def Hippowdon: 186-220 (44.2 - 52.3%) -- 19.1% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
---In this case, when running Rock Slide, the odds are greatly in your favor of getting the kill on M-Pinsir. If rocks are not up, or if Hippo Slack's Off to full health, then M-Pinsirs Return is a grnt'd 3HKO, granting you the kill.

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 88+ SpD Hippowdon in Sun: 333-393 (79.2 - 93.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers
---88 SpD+ is the absolute minimum to always avoid the OHKO from Char Y's Fire Blast, in Sun, after rocks and lefties. This works out well b/c this amount of ev's ends up maxed. However, the slight problem is:

0 Atk Hippowdon Rock Slide vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard Y: 292-348 (97.9 - 116.7%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO
---You need a minimum of 24 Attack EV's to always guarantee the kill on Char Y. I believe, however, that an 87.5% chance is better than resorting to Stone Edge's shaky accuracy, although Stone Edge does guarantee a OHKO on M-Pinsir.

Anyway, there may be a more efficient spread to utilize, but in this case the mixed spread can reliably (ie most of the time) take on both M-Pinsir and Char Y, if they are a threat and you need to take them out in a pinch.

-Another note, if running Phys Def Zapdos with 68 spA ev's, you can take a +2 Return from Jolly M-Pinsir while KO'ing with thunderbolt. Zapdos also, like Rotom-W, hard walls CB Talonflame, with the added benefit of defog and reliable recovery. So, if running a Phys Defensive Zapdos with Hippo, it would probably be more beneficial to dump all of Hippos ev's into SpD in order to handle special attackers like Zard-Y easier. However these two mons share an unfortunate ice weakness, which is probably why they aren't seen paired together as often as, say, Rotom-W and Hippo, who share a somewhat less exploitable grass weakness, but with the prevalence of M-Venu this is made somewhat problematic. With Defensive Rotom-W and SpD Hippo, Rotom can handle Pinsir/Talonflame while Hippo can disrupt Zard Y's Solarbeam and KO 87.5% of the time with rock slide (78.7% of the time factoring in accuracy) - which is just slightly less than using Stone Edge. Would it actually be more helpful to run 24 Atk EV's in order to guarantee the kill?

-Also, seeing as Rock Slide is slashed second on the SpD spread in the OP, and not at all on the Defensive spread, should Hippo even be considered as a check to either of these huge threats? If most of the time Hippo runs toxic, he can't directly do anything to Zard Y or M-Pinsir - just take the hit, toxic, and switch to another teammate to wall. But hippo is supposed to be a wall of sorts, and it's even better that he has the firepower to deal with such threats, so it would be a shame to underutilize his potential.
Just some thoughts, and I'm no authority, as I'm still trying to figure out how this metagame works and trying to learn about as many threats as possible, as in, what do they do, how to counter them, how to even properly use them haha, and how to pair different mons in order to efficiently take on huge players such as M-Pinsir, Aegi, Talonflame, ZardXY, etc and friends (also trying to remember to use the calc as often as possible :P)

-Also, Phys Defensive Hippo absolutely shits on Bisharp, who's knock off does Max 40% and Iron Head/Sucker Punch both clocking in at Max 33%. Hippo's uninvested EQ only has a 25% chance to KO 0 HP Bisharp - Hippo actually needs 160 Atk EV's to guarantee a OHKO on Bisharp, which I think would sharply reduce Hippo's walling capabilities. But most likely no Bisharp player is going to stay in or come in on Hippo anyway, but it is nice to know you can come in on a predicted Bisharp Knock Off, take an iron head (no flinch!), and get the kill on him after two rounds of life orb damage if for some reason he stays in. In this case you are left with min 28% health left. You could also come in on the Knock Off, take an Iron Head, then Slack off. This leaves Bisharp with 80% health after two rounds of Life Orb, while hippo is back up to ~75%. In this case you would most definitely force a switch, and you would be less vulnerable to revenge killing as opposed to the case of taking out Bisharp. It's a toss up between Maximizing Hippo's Health for further encounters as opposed to immediately ridding your team of a potent threat. Most likely tho, you take a knock off or iron head, and Bisharp is forced out, so it would seem that 1 on 1 Hippo beats Bisharp as Bisharp in incapable of 2HKO'ing Hippo. Even at +2, Adamant Bisharp Knock Off does Max 79.2% to 252HP/252Def+ hippo, so on a 1 on 1 situation, Hippo KO's Bisharp almost every time after LO recoil.

-This is getting rather convoluted so I'm going to end my comments here for now, look forward to hearing more discussion on the main hippo. Also like, what other threats does he reliably wall, how does he fare against them what is he capable of etc etc, very interesting haha :P <3
Also, is it of any importance to note that if paired with T-Tar and using Sand Force, you get basically a life orb boost on Earthquake and Rock Slide/stone edge? is this of any use on dedicated sand teams? they probably appreciate the double sand setters tho...im pretty sure i havent even encountered Hippo+T-tar yet so it's either niche/gimmicky/very rare to even run two sand setters at all atm. Anyway, i need to get on to doing other things haha, really glad to be part of this discussion :)
 
Hippowdon is generally a good way of handling Talonflame, but Talonflame's less common Bulk Up/Will-O-Wisp/Roost/Brave Bird Max HP/SpD set is difficult for Hippowdon to manage. After being burnt, Sandstorm Hippowdon only has a small chance of 2HKOing with Rock Slide, which becomes a zero percent chance once Talonflame starts setting up Bulk Ups. Admittedly, it will take a while to break down Hippowdon, and there's always the chance of a critical hit from either Rock Slide, or Earthquake if Talonflame uses Roost, but by and large, this set can force Hippowdon out, and unless there's another check to Talonflame on the team, it could inflict serious damage, or even sweep after 2 or 3 Bulk Ups. An option to bypass this would be running both Toxic and Rock Slide on Hippowdon, allowing it to wall a greater variety of pokemon, while letting another team member set Stealth Rocks.
 
I set I commonly see now is Impish with 240 HP | 192 Def | 76 SDef; these ev's allow it to take 2 hits from Adamant MegaZardX's Flare Blitz but also take Shadow Balls from Modest Aegislash.
 

Martin

A monoid in the category of endofunctors
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I'd suggest putting a sand force AV set in "what else can you try?" I have used it to decent effect, but it is still a little outclassed by the defensive sets.

Also I'm a little skeptical about Rock Slide when this thing gets Stone Edge, and it can guarantee a 2HKO on bulk up variants of Talonflame before they've bulked up - even after a burn, unlike Rock Slide:
  • 0 Atk burned Hippowdon Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Talonflame: 208-246 (57.9 - 68.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (with or without sandstorm damage)
  • 0 Atk Sand Force burned Hippowdon Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Talonflame in Sand: 270-318 (75.2 - 88.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage and Leftovers recovery
 
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