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Unpopular opinions
- Thread starter antemortem
- Start date
In terms of dungeon talk, some of my favorite dungeons:
-Frost Cavern (XY)
This one is just interesting IMO, I love ice stuff and I always felt good traveling it. Sticks out in my mind.
-Victory Road (BW)
This one always stuck out to me because it has visual significance and is fun to explore to me. I like that it uses the 3D well.
-Trainer School (SM/USUM)
Now this, is an extremely unpopular take. In my opinion this is a great bit of gameplay. Good encounters to catch, a few battles to fight and then beating the Principle, who is actually kind of tough in USUM. I like the music, and while some may feel "degraded" I suppose by going through it, I never felt that way. To me its job was to establish that the player is superior as a battler, has talent, etc., which makes sense. I tend to like dungeons for their tight bits of gameplay where every part of the game is expressed, and this mini dungeon does that. Some battles, some optional items, encounters and a miniboss with a unique location done in about 20 minutes.
-Poni Poni Canyon (SM/USUM)
This one has such good music, such interesting backdrops and has a truly "epic" feel to me. Like I'm actually scaling a scary place full of tough Pokemon and trainers. I like the side areas, and I like the story for it.
-Victory Road (ORAS)
This is actually one of my favorite Victory Roads despite being a bit basic visually, but ORAS adds onto it and a much better Wally fight climax, rather than at the start.
I like that the HM use feels pretty clean rather than shit like Kanto/Sinnoh, and I like the trainer battles. Overall I think the pacing is good and right as I feel tired, it's over.
These are just a few, but I do like them. Some other honorable mentions: XY Victory Road, Johto Ice Cave, Mt. Pyre and Pokemon Tower.
-Frost Cavern (XY)
This one is just interesting IMO, I love ice stuff and I always felt good traveling it. Sticks out in my mind.
-Victory Road (BW)
This one always stuck out to me because it has visual significance and is fun to explore to me. I like that it uses the 3D well.
-Trainer School (SM/USUM)
Now this, is an extremely unpopular take. In my opinion this is a great bit of gameplay. Good encounters to catch, a few battles to fight and then beating the Principle, who is actually kind of tough in USUM. I like the music, and while some may feel "degraded" I suppose by going through it, I never felt that way. To me its job was to establish that the player is superior as a battler, has talent, etc., which makes sense. I tend to like dungeons for their tight bits of gameplay where every part of the game is expressed, and this mini dungeon does that. Some battles, some optional items, encounters and a miniboss with a unique location done in about 20 minutes.
-Poni Poni Canyon (SM/USUM)
This one has such good music, such interesting backdrops and has a truly "epic" feel to me. Like I'm actually scaling a scary place full of tough Pokemon and trainers. I like the side areas, and I like the story for it.
-Victory Road (ORAS)
This is actually one of my favorite Victory Roads despite being a bit basic visually, but ORAS adds onto it and a much better Wally fight climax, rather than at the start.
I like that the HM use feels pretty clean rather than shit like Kanto/Sinnoh, and I like the trainer battles. Overall I think the pacing is good and right as I feel tired, it's over.
These are just a few, but I do like them. Some other honorable mentions: XY Victory Road, Johto Ice Cave, Mt. Pyre and Pokemon Tower.
Okay sorry for double post but completely unrelated take:
Gen 4 (DPP/HGSS) being 30fps is fucking embarassing, and also feels kinda ass. The fact that the games look like the GBA + slight 3D elements does not justify 30fps for the next big leak for Pokemon.
While one could argue that not all of these aged well and thus Game Freak maybe made the right call, I think it's less that and more a case of "We need to get it out quickly", because Generation 5 is fucking beautiful for the system.
And it runs at 60FPS IIRC.
DPP spritework is so ass compared to something like Kirby Squeak Squad too lol. Like the overworld models especially
Gen 4 (DPP/HGSS) being 30fps is fucking embarassing, and also feels kinda ass. The fact that the games look like the GBA + slight 3D elements does not justify 30fps for the next big leak for Pokemon.
While one could argue that not all of these aged well and thus Game Freak maybe made the right call, I think it's less that and more a case of "We need to get it out quickly", because Generation 5 is fucking beautiful for the system.
And it runs at 60FPS IIRC.
DPP spritework is so ass compared to something like Kirby Squeak Squad too lol. Like the overworld models especially
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It doesn't.
DS 3D graphics looked hideous even back then, and the DS couldn't do 60 FPS when rending 3D, screens rendering 3D were capped at 30.
My guy, you can't make an argument that the DS cannot handle DPP at 60fps when fucking Black and White exist.
This is not the hardware's fault, it is Game Freak was bad at optimizing the DS at the time. DPP are not that full of 3D! it is rudimentary at best! The battle graphics are basically at the level of the last console!
DPP is ugly as sin, and primitive as HELL compared to Black and White.
BW are also capped at 30 unless you're using one of the DSi models (or the 3DS).
BW looks neither good nor impressive.
2D sprites on 3D backgrounds almost always clash, and locations like Castelia City where they really try to lean into it come off even worse for it. It's like a textbook case of "you're trying to do too much."
Very few Pokemon games actually look or perform impressively compared to contemporary games tbh, and that pair is not an exception.
2D sprites on 3D backgrounds almost always clash, and locations like Castelia City where they really try to lean into it come off even worse for it. It's like a textbook case of "you're trying to do too much."
Very few Pokemon games actually look or perform impressively compared to contemporary games tbh, and that pair is not an exception.
I did not mention that BW was 60fps in that post bc I read what Volt said
What I meant was that you could absolutely optimize DPP to be 60fps lol
It does, but not all the time.
"While the framerate for the overworld is still 30, the framerate has been increased to 60 for battles, the title screen, and 2D menus. However, the opening movie only has a framerate of 15." - Bulbapedia
I can't say if this is correct as I don't see a difference between 30 and 60 FPS (unless it is shown side by side). But it sounds reasonable. Gen 5 always felt a lot faster than Gen 4 to me, especially the battles. When I battled at the Battle Subway in 2020, even stall battles that went down to Struggling could be over in like 5 minutes, while they would have taken much longer in Gen 4.
FPS and graphics aside (neither is imporant to me in Pokémon, or in video games in general), I definitely prefer Gen 5 over Gen 4. In fact, I like to think of Gen 5 as a straight upgrade over Gen 4. Don't know if that's unpopular, but that's my opinion.
Frame rate has absolutely nothing to do with battle speed.
Gen 4 does give the impression that the devs struggled with the new hardware a lot (GF isn't known to have the best coders...)
the fact that all Gen 4 games are slow (DP especially, it's cruel) is another issue, though thankfully there are codes that unlock FPS, and because this is an older game the mechanics are tied to FPS, thus doubling the speed while maintaining the music (at least thats how I think it works)
I couldn't go back to Gen 4 otherwise, though this is very much a side effect of becoming really impatient due to less free time...
the fact that all Gen 4 games are slow (DP especially, it's cruel) is another issue, though thankfully there are codes that unlock FPS, and because this is an older game the mechanics are tied to FPS, thus doubling the speed while maintaining the music (at least thats how I think it works)
I couldn't go back to Gen 4 otherwise, though this is very much a side effect of becoming really impatient due to less free time...
That's a huge plus to BDSP imo.
Everything is so much snappier and quicker it's not even funny.
This is one of the two reasons I would ever get BDSP (the others being HM Poketch), but for now the FPS Code is enough for me...
Such a shame BDSP fails on so many levels despite getting 2 crucial things right, it could have been much more.
oh right, being made with a common engine meant its easily modable
...I correct myself, there are 3 reasons to get BDSP.
I can personally confirm this.oh right, being made with a common engine meant its easily modable
BW/BW2 are passable for the system. Just passable, though hacks are cool
Gen 4 meanwhile is ass, especially DP. HGSS is less ass, but still awkward as fuck. Less said of follower sprites the betterRIP my boy, Golduck
All suffer 4 direction movement and gridded tiles, and that impacts more than just gameplay. Rip the bridge in Kanto never being diagonal like intended
Rangers and Mystery Dungeon spritework dominates mainline despite being purely 2D
Gen 4 meanwhile is ass, especially DP. HGSS is less ass, but still awkward as fuck. Less said of follower sprites the better
All suffer 4 direction movement and gridded tiles, and that impacts more than just gameplay. Rip the bridge in Kanto never being diagonal like intended
I feel this so much. I have become very impatient with games because of lack of actual time to play them, specially when it comes to grinding.
That being said, trough the years I have always tried multiple times (and failed some of them) to go back at HGSS because they are beautiful, which is more than I can say for Diamond. I adore Johto, but I have always struggled on its games because they are quite lacking in many areas- I do think they are overrated, don't kill me.
While on that topic, I don't like how they had mechanics that felt outdated even back then. Drifloom appearing on Fridays was annoying and unnecesary, but at least it was also the kind of thing that would be very exciting as a child so I can give it a pass. The Gym Leaders rematch system on HGSS tho? Who thought of that? It was too extreme and hard to figure out without guides. And I think everyone knows the issues with the Safari Zone...
I guess my point is that I can't appreciate games having a lot of content when it's locked behind obstuse mechanics. And HGSS, as much as I loved them, had plenty.
4 direction movement and gridded tiles were never really a problem. Yes, you technically have to move two more spaces to move diagonally, not really much of an issue. Most old games had rigid movement and pokemon is no exception, but it doesn't really make playing the games an issue.
Also idk which bridge you are talking about? Is it the Route 24 bridge (nugget bridge) or the Route 12 bridge (the one below lavender town). Even if they were intended to be diagonal, they still work fine.
Cycling Road, I would assume, since it’s supposed to be a downhill slope.
(Funny enough, as a kid I don’t think I ever really “got” what was going on there. I think I just took it as some kind of mysterious force exclusive to that area. Maybe I missed some dialogue…)
Yung Dramps
awesome gaming
Wait the cycling roads are supposed to be downhill slopes? If true the fact I didn't know this until now corroborates Sonikku's point to some extent lol
That's more on the tileset and map design than grid mechanics though.
For example, would any of you think this is plain terrain?
For example, would any of you think this is plain terrain?
time-based mechanics were doable as a child (aside from honey trees since I wasn't allowed to play in the morning) but HGSS phone system was annoying even then.
HGSS is pretty much death by a thousand cuts. I like them a lot, but there are lots of small annoyances that add up overtime. Funnily enough some small changes would be able to fix most of it I believe.
I'm somewhat mixed on PMDs spritework actually...
Starters and pretty much all small Pokemon look great, but everything that is a bit bigger looks...messy. Bulbasaur to Deoxys had the problem of having to keep the GBA in mind (which also leads to messed up colors sometimes), but even some Gen 4 mons look...iffy, Empoleon is a good example.
Most of the bigger Legends do avoid this due to bigger sprites.
QuentinQuonce
formerly green_typhlosion
Yes, it's mentioned at least once by NPCs or signposts in the games it appears in.
The bigger issue with Cycling Road is that it's meant, according to nearly all the artwork of the region, to be a massive suspension bridge more akin to the Skyarrow Bridge (explaining how the SS Anne manages to reach the rest of the world whenever it leaves port - it's able to sail under it). But even in HGSS, which depicts it closest to that style, I still found myself looking at it and thinking "really? Could any ship actually manage to pass under... that?"