Articuno, so called "legendary" pokemon is in PU i.e. the worst tier for un-evolved Pokemon.
Yeah I agree with you. Being a legendary doesn't necessarily equate to viability. Look at Kyurem-Black for example, it is bonkers as far as BST is considered, but it sucked so hard in Ubers that it was even BL for some time in 6th gen. Conversely, look at Mega Kanga. That thing was still effective as revenge killer in Ubers despite not being a legendary. Power in competitive play is based on usage and how effective the pokemon is in battle, simple as that. Its not based on whatever arbitrary "legendary" is on the cover of the game. Newbies just don't understand that and play with legendaries thinking they will win every game. Lol XD They shouldn't be on smogon if they don't like to accept reality.First of all, Ultra Beasts technically aren't considered legendaries. Second, if you've come into competitive battling expecting legendaries to be put into a class of their own and all somehow limited or banned, you're going to be extremely disappointed. There's no rule that only legendaries can fight legendaries or anything like that.
This was provided already tho by dragontamer:I rarely run any Legendary Pokemon on my online teams since I find battles more challenging using common Pokemon than those you can only get one of normally (outside of things like the UBs where you sometimes can get more than one of). I have nothing serious against players who use anything that can be regarded as Legendary Pokemon in online battles but I hold a bit of a ruling on when and why I should use them if at all. Right now I'm trying to find Pre-Poke Bank common Pokemon in Alola that can deal with Toxapex as I already have Pokemon on my ORAS and X/Y files that can KO it with less trouble.
you haven't shat up the thread lately what happened?Since I can't really edit and reply to someone else in proper
It is a tough question. The extra damage seems wondrous for a mon who generally has trouble putting quick damage on the foe and it synergizes spectacularly with Regenerator. Often opponents will be quick to switch out their sweeper mons or all out attackers when they fail to make a dent on a switched in Toxapex and against contact hits, it keeps them from getting away scott free while Recover and Regenerator help compensate for the lack of Black Sludge. It can also prove to be vital source of damage against mons you can't Poison or manage to burn with Scald.Ignoring this pokelatent5 guy who seems to have no clue what he's doing, I'm pretty sure Genesect's ban will have no effect on Toxapex (Genesect literally did nothing to this thing unless it was using a Download boosted Thunderbolt, in which case you probably should have run for the hills). Also, is there consensus on the Rocky Helmet vs recovery item debate that was going on a few pages back before this noob showed up?
I actually went with 252 special defense/calm, because Toxapex's defense is naturally higher anyways and Toxapex tends to- as you noted previously- take a lot of special moves. So why not shore up its defenses in that respect? Yes, I know, running Rocky Helmet with a special defense focused spread is counterintuitive, but Pheromosa wasn't even going to do shit to this thing and Megagross was probably still going to 2HKO with Thunderpunch anyways.On another note, is 252 EVs into Defense still the gold standard? I browsed the Good Cores thread and seeing some of the offensive cores list makes me wonder if Toxapex could do with with having more Sp. Def EVs on Bold or outright going for a Calm nature. Just to keep special attackers on their toes.
It can also prove to be vital source of damage against mons you can't Poison or manage to burn with Scald.
No, not that good. Any good player catches you on the switch and EQs his way to victory. You can't afford Toxic on Salazzle if you have to switch a mon that's already weak to ground to use it.unrealisticly good combo.
So your set isn't a thing at all.Using Protect, Detect, Endure, Spiky Shield, King's Shield, Baneful Bunker, Wide Guard, or Quick Guard consecutively decreases the chance of success of Protect, Detect, Endure, Spiky Shield, King's Shield, and Baneful Bunker for each consecutive use.
You cannot use two Protect moves at once. The fail chance carries over one each other If you use both.Stall
Toxapex @ Black Sludge / Any Healing Berry
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Baneful Bunker
- Recover
- Haze / Toxic
- Toxic / Protect
this set is broken, aside from weakness to taunt. the ability to recover and Baneful bunker at free will, ultimate stall.
having 2 protect forms can allow you to stall out a toxic or stop a Stat stacker.
I don't recommend a berry but it works if you need to stay in and can't swap for the regenerator.
Toxapex paired with Salazzle is a rediculous poison combo. My mono-poison team is a serious force in ou.
I feel like Rocky Helmet is still a great way to punish U-turn users in some small manner and chip down Megagross variants that don't run Earthquake, but extra regeneration is still king, I suppose.For the Rocky Helmet vs Black Sludge part, I'd go for Black Sludge. Rocky Helmet is nice, but not many mons are going to do contact damage on Toxapex. Plus Trick does still exist and is a realistic way to ruin Toxapex through Tricking a Choice item onto it.
well that's new to me, thank you. I don't usually use stall sets so the haze + toxic is probably my best bet.You cannot use two Protect moves at once. The fail chance carries over one each other If you use both.
air balloon? I don't recommend using them both for most people but covering ground weaknesses on a team usually isn't that hard.No, not that good. Any good player catches you on the switch and EQs his way to victory. You can't afford Toxic on Salazzle if you have to switch a mon that's already weak to ground to use it.
Back on Toxapex
So your set isn't a thing at all.
So this is a nice set. However, I have one question. I am currently leveling up my mareanie while ev training it and i have came across venoshock. So I taught it the move until later down the road when it will learn the other moves. So I thow it out into battle this was on a level 52 cottonee (yes im aware its giving me speed evs just had to test venoshock will clear out speed ev). I used toxic first turn and then venoshock. So not only is it landing a critical hit but venoshock is doing a whopping 120 damage I believe (not sure if thats right). So I was wondering why isnt that in your move list.Toxapex @ Air Balloon
Ability: Merciless
EVs: 252 HP / 196 Def / 60 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Toxic
- Recover
- Baneful Bunker
- Scald
I have to say that 130base stab CRIT attack will hit hard against just about anything that doesn't resist it, even with 53 sp.atk. Which makes it a pretty nice late game sweeper. But as good of a late game sweeper it is leagues better as a defensive pivot/infinit poison stall.You can't evaluate the performance of a set against in-game Pokémon, especially if they're 4 times weak to your attack, low IV, no EV.
53 SpA does nothing for you competitively even with a 120 BP crit. Sure you can fool around and surprize someone but how many kills will you get? 1 every 15 battles?
Toxapex is forhug and snugwall not forfugsweep
I don't want to sound pretentious or what, considering my post count it would be stupid but why don't you (last posters) keep in mind that Smogon is made to discuss sets that are viable in a particular metagame.
Toxapex has 30 base speed. Even if this combo were a 100% accurate Sheer Cold that hit through Sturdy Toxapex would be a horrible sweeper. Its outrun by Chansey for goodness sake.Which makes it a pretty nice late game sweeper.
I don't think you quite understand the term "Win Condition". The win conditions of the past were Calm Mind Slowbro (Psyshock / Scald / Calm Mind / Slack Off), Crocune (Calm Mind / Rest / Sleep Talk / Scald Suicune), Calm Mind Unaware Clefable. These Pokemon have absurdly huge defenses AND the ability to OHKO the entire team due to a good set-up attack AND have somewhat reliable recovery to stay healthy.Right now toxapex is one of the few extreme stall pokemon that are win conditions if the opponent doesn't bring a direct check/counter.
I think part of the problem is that there's basically no room for creativity here. Scald / Toxic / Recover / Haze is more or less perfection for this Pokemon. Maybe slash a "Toxic Spikes" in there?Can we get back to discussing something relevant to the OU meta now? We've discussed why this set is a bad idea, and I think once that information has been presented, better to return to normal discussion and leave accepting that information to the other party.
Toxic Spikes is definitely an option over Toxic if you don't want to have to poison everything that comes in individually. Only problem is that its a little difficult to keep them on the field with Mega Venusaur more popular than ever and with stuff like Mantine and Tapu Fini (I'm assuming Misty Terrain blocks Toxic Spikes?) being able to just come in and Defog them away for free. Still, it's certainly a decent option to break through bulkier teams a little better and to quickly poison an entire team.I think part of the problem is that there's basically no room for creativity here. Scald / Toxic / Recover / Haze is more or less perfection for this Pokemon. Maybe slash a "Toxic Spikes" in there?
It also has Light Screen, that's kinda useful. But Alolan-Ninetails does that better.
The only thing that might warrant discussion is Infestation + Binding Band. But I'm not even sure that a gimmick set like that is much better than the standard set. Its difficult for me to even imagine a situation where Infestation / Binding Band would be superior to the other set. Its only real benefit is that you deal 1/6th the opponent's switchin HP damage, AND they can't double-switch on you. So I guess you get a slight advantage as far as switch-momentum?
Toxic Spikes act before the terrain gets up, so Tapu Fini will get poisoned. Every other good spinner and defogger is immune, though.Toxic Spikes is definitely an option over Toxic if you don't want to have to poison everything that comes in individually. Only problem is that its a little difficult to keep them on the field with Mega Venusaur more popular than ever and with stuff like Mantine and Tapu Fini (I'm assuming Misty Terrain blocks Toxic Spikes?) being able to just come in and Defog them away for free. Still, it's certainly a decent option to break through bulkier teams a little better and to quickly poison an entire team.
Binding Band seems like nothing more than a gimmick to me. Toxapex doesn't particularly appreciate missing out on the recovery that Black Sludge provides and I don't think the partial trapping effect is nearly as good as the increasing damage from poison or the halved attack from a Scald burn.