You can't trade it through GTS, but Home has person-to-person trades and only a handful of Pokemon are (were?) banned from those
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Sticky Orange Islands SQSA Thread
- Thread starter DHR-107
- Start date
Could someone give me the run-down on how moves get overwritten/remembered when you transfer them in and out of different games via Pokemon Home?
For example, if I have a pokemon in Sword that knows a move it can no longer learn in Scarlet, how does that work if I try to transfer it from Sword to Scarlet?
For example, if I have a pokemon in Sword that knows a move it can no longer learn in Scarlet, how does that work if I try to transfer it from Sword to Scarlet?
The games have completely separate movesets.
When moving a pokemon from Home to one of the gen 8+ games, the game defaults to their level up movepool, however you are also able to manually select the moveset in Home itself. Any move present in the game that was learned by the pokemon somewhere will be available (es, if you move a Slowbro from SwSh to SV and it learned Scald and Toxic at some point, Scald will be amongst the moves selectable when moving to SV, but not Toxic as it does not learn that move in SV.
This operation is repeated any time you move a Pokemon from Home to a gen 8+ game.
Does this mean you could teach TMs by moving something in and out of Home?
Slowbro in SV only knows Surf.
Put in Home.
Begin to transfer back to SV and select a moveset that now includes Scald even though you don't have the TM?
Yes! You can indeed "game the system" in that way. As long as the pokemon can learn the move in SV, often it can be more practical to teach it the moves in SwSh or LA.
(This also gives easier TM access in BDSP)
Has there been any precedent of a Pokemon already in-game changing its moveset availability without new TM's/Tutors between DLC's (by which I mean it was playable and then got a move added, not just disproven mines like the Gen 8 Tapus)? We already have seen GF change things like stats and BP between patches when things become available but to my knowledge nothing has been mroe directly buffed/nerfed in this manner once it exists in game.
Yes, I'm salty about Garchomp mats being used for the Dragon Dance TM but not being able to learn from it.
Yes, I'm salty about Garchomp mats being used for the Dragon Dance TM but not being able to learn from it.
The closest we've came is actually the latest patch. A number of Pokemon had lost all their egg moves, and wouldn't be allowed to grab them even through Home because they weren't in their full learn set, but thanks to the patch they finally reimplemented them. They also fixed a few other odds & ends like how Female Indeedee could only get Trick Room through Raids, despite Male Indeedee still learning it through TM.
However none of them got new egg moves out of the deal, the Raid situation was primarily just giving moves they should have had to begin with (& often had prior), so this was more "fixing oversights" than "direct buff".
They've never changed stats between patches?
Technically there was one set of changes: 1.0 -> 1.0.1 tweaked the Treasures of Ruin's stats (10 less BST, some minor rearranging of stat points).
but it was the day 1 patch (or day 0, I guess to be more accurate) so goes more to what pika pal said "when things become available".
Pre Dexit, what are restrictions (if any) on trading Pokemon:
- from Gen 3 thru Pal Park into Gen 4
- from Gen 4 thru Poke Transfer into Gen 5
- from Gen 5 thru Poke Transporter into Gen 6
- from Gen 6 thru Pokemon Bank into Gen 7
- from Gen 7 thru Pokemon Bank into Home
Outside of temporary forms (so non-Go Furfrou's coats because they get wiped every time they enter the PC, pre-gen 9 Hoopa Unbound which likewise gets reverted, etc) + Spiky Eared Pichu & ORAS' Cosplay Pikachu (neither of which can even be traded out of their cart, much less put in Bank), the only other exception I can think of is Shiny Jirachi from gen 3. Like you can get one out of the bonus disc but Bank's hack check was overly stringent and considered it a hack. But I think that got fixed when they released a "real" Shiny Jirachi so that may not even be an issue anymore.
I guess there's also stuff that abuses glitches. Like I think if you do the DP tweaking to get Darkrai & Shaymin they don't have the proper flags set so they get probably blocked somewhere in the process; probably Bank since I can't recall Transfer having any real hack checking. And if you do the Mew glitch on VC I think it still has to match certain paramters to not be blocked.
Far as I can see from a quick check of Bulbapedia, the "temp form" Pokemon that can only be transferred as default should be:
- Castform (can't change outside battle)
- Kyogre, Groudon (can't change outside battle)
- Cherrim (can't change outside battle)
- Giratina (can't transfer items)
- Shaymin (reverts in the PC)
- Arceus (can't transfer items)
- Darmanitan (can't change outside battle)
- Black/White Kyurem (can't go to Bank)
- Meloetta (can't change outside battle)
- Genesect (can't transfer items)
- Furfrou (reverts in the PC)
- Aegislash (can't change outside battle)
- Xerneas (can't change outside battle)
- Hoopa (reverts in the PC)
- Wishiwashi (can't change outside battle)
- Silvally (can't transfer items)
- Minor (can't change outside battle)
- Mimikyu (can't change outside battle)
- Necrozma fusion (can't go into Bank)
They fixed the Jirachi thing, Darkrai and Shaymin only get flagged as hacked from tweaking if they're non-Japanese, since the Member Card and Oak's Letter were never distributed outside Japan. And they do actually go through if you tweak if you also hack in Cherish Balls to catch them in, Bank checks language and ball for them.
There's no hack checking anywhere until you get to trying to transfer from Gen 5 to Bank and if you can get them past the hack checks in the PokeTranspoter you're home free, Home doesn't check the legality of Pokémon coming in from Bank since it assumes that Bank already did.
The Rotoms do get shoved out of their machine in Gen 4 when you do basically anything other than put them in a box. So only regular Rotom will go to Gen 5, at least.
But I think within Gen 5 you have free reign to trade, transfer and store them since they no longer have to worry about incompatability issues.
Worth bringing up: this was obviously addressing a mistake, but not exactly the mistake you think!
Indeedee-F not learning the TM was the intended behavior to begin with and has always been an intentional difference between the forms, even in Gen VIII; the raid giving it to the female form at all is the part that was an error.
To compare: in Gen VIII, male Indeedee got all of the room moves to itself (Trick Room, Magic Room and Wonder Room) while female got exclusive access to the screen moves instead (Reflect, Light Screen and Safeguard); male got Power Split and Power Swap and female got Guard Split and Guard Swap; and they each had exactly five other exclusive moves that are a bit harder to fit into neat parallels: male got After You, Encore, Extrasensory, Last Resort and Tri Attack, while female got Baton Pass, Follow Me (!!!!!!), Heal Pulse, Healing Wish and Psycho Shift.
The list of movepool differences between the two got a bit smaller this Gen with the different TM list, but they would still have had an equal number of exclusive moves (seven each) if female didn't get Trick Room, while the mistake of giving it Trick Room gave them a more lopsided six exclusive moves (male) to seven exclusive moves (female). This bit doesn't really mean anything in terms of "fairness" or whatever when you compare the quality of their moves, but I think it does help to clarify the "vision" behind the duo's movepools and reinforce that it was intentional for Indeedee-F to miss out on Trick Room.
More from the point of view of analyzing gameplay, the female form was already drastically better of the two in VGC because of its better bulk and the incredible value and scarcity of Follow Me alone compared to basically any of the other moves that were exclusive to either form.
Moreover, the absence of Trick Room was arguably an interesting drawback compared to the increasingly long list of supportive Psychic/Normal-types - not only the other Indeedee but also Oranguru, Wyrdeer and Farigiraf, which are all in SV and all made for VGC (I know Oranguru saw usage in at least one of the SM series, and Farigiraf has actually been doing pretty well for itself too this year, which I love). These are all sidegrades of a similar archetype and basically all value Trick Room a great deal as their primary role on a team, but Indeedee-F, which might well have been the best of the bunch even without Trick Room or at least been reserved for a different style of team, was very much intended to create a meaningful tradeoff by leaving it out.
As for how the mistake took place and why it stuck:
first of all, the two Indeedee forms have distinct 3* raids that account for their movepool differences, but their 5* raids instead have an identical moveset that just happened to be legal for the male and not for the female, implying that the Indeedee-F raid that started all of this might have just... been wrongly copy-pasted from Indeedee-M by someone who didn't know any better. P: Like, this is entirely understandable and a really easy thing to overlook, so I can't blame them; look at how many people assume that it not learning the move is the part that was a mistake in the first place.
Once that happened, retconning its TM compatibility was the only reasonable response - I mean, there wasn't really anything else they could do. Trick Room has been competitively run on Indeedee-F throughout VGC so far (and it's a unsurprisingly a really big deal on it), and obviously people already have it, so it's not really something you can just sweep under the rug by fixing the raid itself. At that point, I'm sure Game Freak must have felt it was better to make it more accessible, because the alternative would be to do nothing and leave it in this weird state of "technically legal, very competitively relevant, but super obscure and unnatural to get."
I regret that it kinda messed with what might have been a really clean competitive dynamic, and I feel like Indeedee-F definitely oversteps the boundaries it was designed for by having it, but I mean... I'm sure the designers feel that way too on some level - they just accepted that it was unfeasible to backpedal on something like this post-release, so instead they made the adjustments that SV could actually support. Only time will tell if Indeedee-F keeps the move in later Gens or if they take the opportunity to take it back out when they can wipe transfer moves in Gen X.
Let's say I transfer a pokemon from Sword to Scarlet that has 4 carefully chosen egg moves.
Will those egg moves be re-learnable once the pokemon is in Scarlet?
Assuming all 4 moves are still available to the species? Yes.
QuentinQuonce
formerly green_typhlosion
Obviously, eggs cannot be transferred - Pokemon with HMs can be transferred from Gen 6 onwards, Bank has no restriction. Cosplay Pikachu is unable to be deposited in Bank so cannot be moved forward either. The four totem Pokemon that were introduced in USUM (Marowak, Ribombee, Araquanid, Togedemaru) cannot be placed in Bank while the others can be.
I'm actually really interested in how glitch items affect Pal Park, as I've read that some glitch items prevent a Pokemon from being migrated if held while others do not (and have varying effects when transferred), but it's not something I have the capability to investigate myself.
You didn't mention the VC titles, but there's a couple of Pokemon that are blocked from being sent to Bank with certain moves there: Mewtwo is considered invalid by Poketransporter if it knows Pay Day, and all the Odd Egg Pokemon are considered illegal if they know Dizzy Punch. However, I'm fairly sure Pokemon obtained by the Mew glitch transfer without issue (not sure about legendaries, though - should try that). The hack checks in general are a bit iffy; I was traded a shiny V-Create Rayquaza a while back not realising that that particular event wasn't shiny, but there was no issue with receiving it.
The Kami trio can be transferred to Bank in either guise; it's just in Gen V that they can't be traded in their Therian Formes since they don't exist in BW. Similarly, Rotom only reverts when traded in Gen IV iirc and I'm pretty sure I have some appliance form Rotom in my bank atm.
Does pokemon size only function in the overworld or in battle as well?
It's visible in both, yeah
Didn’t know this. They’re fully leaning into trolling us huh?
From what I understand, it's any Route (or outside area in the Sevii Islands).
Here's a list of the rematch trainers.
Out of curiosity, am I the only one who's really struggling to get into non-7 star raids in last month or so? Almost always the game fails to connect, I think I manage to get into 1 out of 10 when i'm lucky and often have to go through 3-4 refreshes before one lets me in.
(Doesn't help that most of the people I find are bringing level 60-70 mons to 6 stars...)
(Doesn't help that most of the people I find are bringing level 60-70 mons to 6 stars...)