ORAS Doubles OU Not too far pls

[crazyroto2]

Hello guys. I am new at making competitive teams, as I used to copy other teams to learn more about the metagame. I've tried OU, Ubers, double OU teams and, by far, I've really enjoyed the double ou tier as there are more possibilites and more possible tactics.

By playing games I learnt that speed control is really important, so I tried Tailwind teams but... there was a think that always annoyed my copied tailwind teams: Trick room. Then I thought, why not try to make a trick room team?

Obviously I needed a Trick Room setter: Cresselia. I cant tel anything that you dont know about this poke, so, here u have the set details:

Cresselia @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 228 SpA / 32 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Helping Hand
- Trick Room
​

Not as bulky as it can be, 228 SpA lets him to effectively hit some pokemons like garchomp or landorus-T. The mission of this cresselia is easy to understand, put Trick Room and then, if needed, help his allie with Helping Hand. If not, he can 2OKHO some pokemons. Sitrus berry will help him to survive more time.

Rotom-Wash @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 240 HP / 16 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Hydro Pump
- Protect
- Volt Switch
​

I've thought about a Choice Scarf rotom with Trick, but this set have worked well by the moment. His mission is to hit as harder to flying pokemons (especially charizard, talonflame and gyarados) as he resists. It also works well against Heatran. Nothing remarcable about this pokemon.

Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Gyro Ball
- Power Whip
- Protect
​

When the enemies sees this pokemon they think about thunder wave, spikes, stealth rock... Who thinks about a swords dancer Ferro? Noone. As enemy fire pokes get killed (normally by the washing machine) Ferro can start his own party. Swords dance provides him with an acceptable 630 atk. He is one of the fastest pokemons in Trick Room so... Start to sweep.

Gyro ball and power whips are the most powerful attacks, botch receive STAB bonus. As ferro only has 40 speed, gyro ball can hit really hard to much pokemons in the metagame, and power whip gives him a good doverage (and it's also powerful). Dont trust me? Check it: https://pokemonshowdown.com/damagecalc/ Dont get a swords dance boost? Dont worry, Cressellia or Whismicott will hand-help him.

Camerupt-Mega @ Cameruptite
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Heat Wave
- Rock Slide
- Earth Power
- Protect

​

Really slow and with a quite great bulk... Heat Wave can be a very strong movement in double. With Sheer Force boost, and sometimes, with Helping Hand, it can be a double OKHO in some cases. Rock Slide for Charizard and Talonflame, if the machine washine cant deal with them. Earth power for Heatran, Tyranitar...

It's also really fast in Trick Room, and qith Sheer Force and 427 SpA he can make great holes into enemy teams.

Conkeldurr @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Drain Punch
- Facade
- Knock Off
- Protect

​

Nothing new about Flame Orb + Guts Conkeldurr. Drain Punch to recover some HP, Knock Off and Facade are useful for hitting hard ando also Knock Off can break some enemy strategies. Conke is also really fast in Trick Room. Protect helps him to get burned withouth problems.

Whimsicott @ Focus Sash
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Taunt
- Helping Hand
- Protect
​

Not as bulky as Cresselia, Whimsicott is the one that has to set Trick Room again if Cresselia cant, so Focus Sash is needed. Taunt it's important as Amoongus can be a great problem vs this team, and Helping Hand is useful to help M-Camperupt to make holes in the enemy team.


I'll share u replays...

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/doublesou-348426794




So... Any ideas about how to improve this team?

 

[Yellow Paint]

Hello, and welcome to Smogon! Trick Room tends to become a very repetitive teambuilding style, but I have to say I've only seen SD Ferro a few times. Props for experimenting. That said, your team could use a few changes to help it deal with general threats in the meta.

Washtom should have Will-O-Wisp > Volt Switch. Outside of Conkeldurr, you're still fairly weak to Kangaskhan, so wisp helps check it and other physical attackers. Also, Sitrus Berry simply gives more efficient recovery.

Ferrothorn should have Lum Berry > Rocky Helmet. Helm tends to be pretty unnecessary since you already have iron barbs, while lum lets Ferro absorb a burn without becoming completely crippled.

Camerupt is fine, though you might wanna consider ancientpower or fire blast instead of rock slide. You tend to only want to hit a single target harder when you need rock coverage, and fire blast does solid single target damage across the board. Among other things, it gets an ohko on Amoonguss that heat wave does not.

You should replace Conkeldurr with Hariyama. As of now you lack a reliable way of setting tr, and Hariyama's fake out helps greatly with your first or second set while hitting even harder than conk. By the way, Conk's main niche is mach punch and slightly better bulk than Hariyama and Scrafty.

Whimsicott is kind of all around mediocre the way you're using it, a better and bulkier tr setter would be Porygon2.

team after changes

Cresselia @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 228 SpA / 32 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Helping Hand
- Trick Room

Rotom-Wash @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 240 HP / 16 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Hydro Pump
- Protect
- Volt Switch

Ferrothorn @ Lum Berry
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Gyro Ball
- Power Whip
- Protect

Camerupt-Mega @ Cameruptite
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Heat Wave
- Ancient Power
- Earth Power
- Protect

Hariyama @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 128 Def / 128 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Fake Out
- Close Combat
- Knock Off
- Protect

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: Download
EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 20 SpA / 76 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Trick Room
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Recover

 

[Sylveon.]

Hey...how are you today, quite a unconventional team you have got there, it looks fun to use but just a few changes-

1) I feel calm mind cress set is the best one for your team, as even with mega cam you struggle a bit against sun teams + cress is goddess, she easily takes 2 hits in same turn sets up TR reliably, plus safety goggles set allows it to set up on amoongus and sleep shenanigans like brelooms, blieve me on this one, I have been an advent user of TR teams and cm cress is an excellent win con.

Cresselia @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Moonlight
- Trick Room

2)Not being rude or something, but rotom is not a good TR mon instead as you always won't be able to set up so you can apply pressure by using a scarfed lando-t, I know its boring but you have to admit it is pretty good.

3)Love offensive ferro though, but you can also try lum berry>Rocky helmet
ALSO Bulldoze>Protect as it allows to beat heatrans after a little chip damage

+2 252+ Atk Ferrothorn Bulldoze vs. 180 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 328-388 (89.1 - 105.4%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO

4)Mega cam is good as it is, but I think you need a redirector as it is your main wallbreaker, so amoongus>ferro is good too, powerful aqua jets from mons like azumarill could just knock it out even before you move.

5) Hariyama or scarfty > Conkellder coz "FAKE OUT".

Hariyama @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 128 Def / 128 SpD
Brave Nature
- Fake Out
- Close Combat
- Knock Off
- Wide Guard

6) Whimsi is pretty bad TR setter, so you are better off using some offensive TR setter, something even crazy as victini, as it improves your sun matchup and since now you have wide guard so it becomes pretty good, plus spamming v-create is pretty awesome inside TR, it actually took me to #1 in ladder, so don't underestimate it, its bulky and pretty effective if used well or if you are feeling really weak to aegislash then use porygon2 as a safety net.

Victini @ Life Orb
Ability: Victory Star
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 HP
Brave Nature
- V-create
- Bolt Strike
- Protect
- Trick Room (make speed ivs :: 0)

So thats the team, anyways best of luck :o)

 

[crazyroto2]

Thanks for your comments!

But, Are u sure that Lum berry is the correct one for Ferro? I think that you meant Occa bery, true?

In fact, Whimsicott didnt work well as a TR setter so, as suggested, I've changed it for Porygon 2. I will also try that stronk Victini. I've also changed the Conk for Hariyama, with Wide Guard instead of Protect. As I have Cmerupt with Earth Power, Hari with close combat and Hydro Rotom Wash, I've decided to mantain Ferro with Protect and not to change Protect for Bulldoze.

That's the team now:

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: Download
EVs: 248 HP / 164 Def / 20 SpA / 76 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Trick Room
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Recover

Rotom-Wash @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 240 HP / 16 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Thunderbolt
- Hydro Pump
- Will-O-Wisp
- Protect

Ferrothorn @ Occa Berry
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Gyro Ball
- Power Whip
- Protect

Camerupt-Mega @ Cameruptite
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Heat Wave
- Ancient Power
- Earth Power
- Protect

Cresselia @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Moonlight
- Trick Room

Hariyama @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 128 Def / 128 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Fake Out
- Close Combat
- Knock Off
- Wide Guard

 

[Yellow Paint]

252+ Atk Life Orb Talonflame Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Occa Berry Ferrothorn: 328-385 (93.1 - 109.3%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
No, I mean lum. Ferro's 4x weakness to fire and the general strength of fire attackers means it will still take heavy damage even with occa. Lum makes it so you don't get ruined by a Will-O-Wisp from gengar or washtom or a random scald from suicune. It'll also help in the event of a swagger or twave from one of our lovely pranksters.

 

[ryo yamada2001]

Hey there! Yellow Paint did a real good job on the original rate, but I still disagree a bit with the importable you just posted above.

On Porygon2 you should use 0 Speed IVs. That allows it to be as slow as possible and not lose to other Trick Room attackers or slow threats.

The set that you're using on

Ferrothorn is quite poor in my opinion, due to the fact that Swords Dance needs time to set up and takes up a slot that would rather be used for utility moves (such as Leech Seed, Thunder Wave outside of Trick Room, and maybe even Stealth Rock). One of the strengths of Ferrothorn is that it has an easy time using Leech Seed against anything that does not have a 100% reliable way to beat it, combined with powerful Gyro Balls and Power Whips. This is the set that I would use:

Ferrothorn

Ferrothorn @ Lum Berry
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Atk / 84 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Power Whip
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Protect

You could also change Ferrothorn to Amoonguss:

Amoonguss would in this case greatly improve your Keldeo matchup though, especially considering Mega Camerupt's weakness to it, Porygon2's weakness to it, and Hariyama's inability to switch in to Keldeo's Secret Swords and Hydro Pumps. Without drastically changing around your team, Amoonguss would be the best bet against it, as it has an easy time switching in to Secret Swords, doesn't mind getting burned by Scald as much as Ferrothorn does (as it just loses all offensive presence at that point), and doesn't mind getting chip damaged by Hydro Pump, as it can usually get a big heal% back with Regenerator and Giga Drain. Now while your teammates are still weak to Keldeo, Amoonguss can easily use Rage Powder so it redirects the Secret Sword and Hydro Pump towards it. Outside of that, you are a big threat in Trick Room, as you will almost always move first in Trick Room considering your low speed, by easily being able to abuse Spore.

Amoonguss

Amoonguss @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Protect
- Rage Powder
- Giga Drain
- Spore

Now you might be fairly weak to Fairy spam (Mega Gardevoir, Sylveon) by your only resist being Mega Camerupt, and Cresselia and Porygon being able to do basically nothing to it, I would use

Heatran over Mega Camerupt. It just cucks Fairies so well by resisting their attacks, and just being able to Substitute in their faces. Mega Camerupt doesn't really add much that Heatran doesn't, so I personally think Heatran is better in this case, as it also beats Talonflame.

Heatran

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 Def
Modest Nature
- Substitute
- Heat Wave
- Earth Power
- Protect

Also lastly, now you've probably noticed I have removed your Mega Pokemon, but fear not, I suggest using

Mega Kangaskhan over Rotom-Wash in this case. I think Rotom-Wash is very weak (especially Sitrus Berry variants), and I think Mega Kangaskhan would help your overall matchup. Also what's fun about Mega Kangaskhan, is that it is
another Fake Out user that can help set up Trick Room (did i just build checkroom checkmater75)

Mega Kangaskhan

elise (Kangaskhan-Mega) @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Inner Focus
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature
- Fake Out
- Double-Edge
- Sucker Punch
- Hammer Arm

Hammer Arm also helps you be slower in Trick Room, but if you prefer you could also use Power-Up Punch or Seismic Toss. Double-Edge can be replaced by Return as well.

Now I won't go even wilder with your team, considering I already changed the entire composition, but your team from a glance definitely looks Keldeo weak. I would personally use Jellicent over Porygon2 to improve your Fighting matchup, but that leaves you weak versus Aegislash. You might be able to swap around Cresselia for

Hoopa-Unbound, and Porygon2 for

Jellicent, but hey that is personal preference I guess, I think those two setters are a bit less passive and more offensively present.

I hope I haven't changed around your team too much (oops!), but I hope this rate has helped you! If you have any questions, feel free to ask me! ^_^