Magic: The Gathering

What I find much more interesting than the AVR spoilers can be summed up in three words.

Return. To. Ravnica.

EDIT: Avacyn looks expensive, and maybe not worth it except for EDH? Sigarda might be one of the most cost-efficient cards ever made. 5/5 with Hexproof/Flying and prevents sacrifices for 5? Nice, even for a multi-colored card.
 

Myzozoa

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Why? I don't think it'll see much play even in modern where it's barely passable.

"I Magma Jet you on my upkeep, take 2. Scry 2. Draw step. Miracle, take 5."
 
I agree with myzozoa to a point. Unless you're running a deck full of Scry, Miracles won't be terribly useful. Even then, your key cards operating on luck (no matter how fixed that luck may be) isn't the best strategy. If anything, these are spicy draft cards, nothing more.
But, damn, that 1U Time Walk is sexy.
 
Temporal Mastery will either be banned in legacy/restricted in vintage or will lead to the banning of brainstorm and/or sensei's divining top. Overall, miracle is just a really stupid mechanic. It doesn't really add any strategical depth to the game, as the cards are either completely absurdly busted (time walk reprint), or too low-impact even for standard (the condemn for artifacts/creatures/enchantments)
 

Myzozoa

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I'm not familiar with the legacy meta, but it seems like counter magic is a very sure fire answer to miracle strategies. The decks most able to utilize an extra turn are least able to resolve a Temporal Mastery, so perhaps if they are not banned we will see a return to protracted Blue control strategies.
 
Miracle is not even close to busted.

It's one of the hardest mechanics to exploit ever printed, and when you're not exploiting them they're unreliable or uncastable.


So far, only the Time Walk looks even close to playable outside of Limited, and even then it's hard to see where it would be played outside of long-game U/x Control in Standard. Nothing else wants a 7 mana dead card.
 

Myzozoa

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My friends and I were discussing abusing Miracle, and my question is, what stops me from 'claiming' that I drew x card first? It seems like the easiest way to exploit this mechanic is to claim that you drew it first regardless of whether or not you did. And obviously if someone tries to cast anything involving miracle you just say that they didn't draw it first thing, it's such a stupid mechanic to enforce rules wise.
 
you draw the card, look at it (while keeping it separate from the rest of your hand), and reveal it if you want to cast it. so basically as soon as anyone actually puts the card into their hand it's their loss afaic.
 
My friends and I were discussing abusing Miracle, and my question is, what stops me from 'claiming' that I drew x card first? It seems like the easiest way to exploit this mechanic is to claim that you drew it first regardless of whether or not you did. And obviously if someone tries to cast anything involving miracle you just say that they didn't draw it first thing, it's such a stupid mechanic to enforce rules wise.
Yeah, Tea_demon is right. You *have* to reveal the card as you draw it and cast it then, even if it is a sorcery (i.e. temporal mastery). Also ITT MrIndigo doesn't understand formats other than standard (but he is right that temporal mastery is pretty underwhelming in standard)
 

Zystral

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My thoughts on Temporal Mastery;
T1:Delver
T2:Delver 2, Ponder, put Time Walk second.
T3, flip both Delvers. Get Time Walk, swing for 12.
 
My thoughts on Temporal Mastery;
T1:Delver
T2:Delver 2, Ponder, put Time Walk second.
T3, flip both Delvers. Get Time Walk, swing for 12.
A deck like Delver, with 8+ cantrips, a highly tempo-based game that plans its plays several turns in advance does NOT want to play Miracle cards. They cannot afford to hit 7 mana dead cards.


Amazing godhands don't make things playable, boys and girls.
 
Yeah, Tea_demon is right. You *have* to reveal the card as you draw it and cast it then, even if it is a sorcery (i.e. temporal mastery). Also ITT MrIndigo doesn't understand formats other than standard (but he is right that temporal mastery is pretty underwhelming in standard)
It's quite good with Brainstorm (The time walk one; the rest are all shit), but it's bad in many other situations without BStorm. I'm not sure it's generally playable because many of the decks in that format, like Maverick or Stoneblade have similar problems to Delver in Standard.

PVDDR + Chapin + LSV have all made comments of a similar nature, so I'm in pretty good company.
 

Mr.E

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Doesn't really matter in the eternal formats, worst thing you can do with Temporal Mastery is pitch it to Force of Will. Standard, Modern or whatever there's major upside to running at least one copy. 12% auto-mulligan, rest of the time I get Time Walk? With a card that good, I'll take my chances. Straight control decks might even run multiple copies, since they actually plan to make it to the point of being able to hardcast the things (not ideal at 7 mana but hey, a free turn's a free turn). I don't think Miracles.dec will be a major player, at least not in Standard, but god damn what were they thinking?

Thunderous Wrath isn't all that great. Even at the Miracle cost, sure it's pretty efficient then but you still don't get to choose the optimal timing to cast it like you would a typical burn spell. Bolt your guy in response to equipment, in combat, your face end of turn after I realize I don't need to kill a dude with it. There's no opportunity to gain tempo off it and it's overkill on most early-game creatures anyway. It's more like a big Rift Bolt that has a chance of showing up in your opening hand and being horribly inefficient, or even just showing up early and ruining your curve (Turn 2 Shrine of Burning Rage, etc.) by obligating you to spend that R when you might already have plans to spend all your mana.
 

tape

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startin to play MtG IRL for my first time, only now realizin it is as expensive as everyone says.
 
It's quite good with Brainstorm (The time walk one; the rest are all shit), but it's bad in many other situations without BStorm. I'm not sure it's generally playable because many of the decks in that format, like Maverick or Stoneblade have similar problems to Delver in Standard.

PVDDR + Chapin + LSV have all made comments of a similar nature, so I'm in pretty good company.
You're missing the point. You don't just jam it into all the fair decks (maverick, stoneblade), it just makes all the combo decks retardedly powerful. I imagine that high tide will be the best deck in the format if the ban list isn't changed. Your friend is probably right though, it is likely just an excuse to ban brainstorm. If that happens, it becomes a niche card that might see play in one or two combo decks but generally not worth it.
 
So, I feel like we should talk about another preview card besides Temporal Mastery? Maybe it's my inner Timmy speaking, but I am loving all the cool legends that AVR is pumping out. Using Kaalia in EDH is looking more and more fun! :D



EDIT @ Below: Holy Kitten Barbecue, Batman! That wasn't in the Card Image Gallery earlier! Must... have...
 
Browbeat on Legs. Terrible in Standard, I think, but probably good in Legacy burn and hilarious in EDH with my squabbly group.
 

Myzozoa

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Do people let it stick and then use a removal spell on it? Or do they take 4 damage? You'll never get the one you want if you play it.

It seems like it's much better in Red Deck Wins as opposed to burn, as RDW plays creatures and burn tends to avoid them.
 

matty

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Hey, sorta haven't been in #mtg in awhile, but I'm hosting a French EDH 1v1 Tourney on the Salvation forums if anyone visits there

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=406550

Registrations close Sunday April 15th, but if you want in, just PM me on the Smogon forums and I'll add you. The banlist is similar to regular EDH minus all the colorless ramp. Let me know
 
Do people let it stick and then use a removal spell on it? Or do they take 4 damage? You'll never get the one you want if you play it.

It seems like it's much better in Red Deck Wins as opposed to burn, as RDW plays creatures and burn tends to avoid them.
Except RDW wants actual creatures, not 4-point-face-only burn spells that simply pretend to be creatures.


Legacy burn already runs 4 Confidant and 4 Goblin Guide, so they're not losing much in the way of virtual card advantage when they add this guy to their lineup over Lava Spike.



I'm really not sure how I feel about Tamiyo. I like her, aesthetically, but I don't know how good she is at 5 mana. I love how everyone thought her ultimate was weak because they didn't realise it said "from anywhere"... including the stack. Forbid/Rewind/Foil = infinite counterspells!

So yeah, her ultimate is pretty amazing, but I need to see how she fares getting to it before I decide whether she's my new It Girl for Esper Control.
 

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