Other Don't use that, use this [XY OU Edition]

[Shiruba]

Ehhh... I somewhat disagree, actually. In most circumstances, it's better to use Ferrothorn, you're absolutely right. However, Forretress has a few tricks up its sleeve to distinguish itself:

1) Can Spin as well as set up its own hazards. I don't like the attitude people have that Defog eclipses Rapid Spin; it's simply not true. It's generally better to get rid of their hazards while still keeping yours. It just is, this is common sense. With Rapid Spin, you don't have to set up your hazards again and thus waste even more valuable turns, which is especially important for Spikes stacking. You're also not vulnerable to Taunt and Defiant at the cost of being spinblocked and making contact. You also don't need to use another slot to deal with hazard removal like you would with Ferrothorn, though this usually puts a lot of pressure on Forretress in the match. Still, it's there if you need to crunch teamslots for whatever reason.

2) Volt Switch for momentum. Still very cool, and eases prediction so you're not swapping blindly.

3) Slightly bulkier on the physical side. Not sure if it helps it survive anything specific, but Forretress has also got only one weakness, unlike Ferrothorn, at the cost of some resistances.

Sturdy's also situationally useful when you're at full health [not terribly likely, considering you're a spinner], to survive something to get up a crucial hazard, which can be helpful at times. RIP Custap Berry.

Either way, while I agree that Forretress is UU for a reason, that doesn't change the fact that it does have its own niche or two and isn't completely eclipsed.

[also, if you're gonna do calcs, use the same set for both, please - I'm pretty sure Physically Defensive is the standard Forretress set]
252+ Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Forretress: 102-121 (28.8 - 34.1%) -- 99.1% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 108-127 (30.6 - 36%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
[who the bloomin' hell uses Adamant Garchomp?]

4 Atk Forretress Gyro Ball (109 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Garchomp: 112-133 (31.2 - 37.1%) -- 81.9% chance to 3HKO
[not terrible all things considered]

 

[Uberlox]

Ehhh... I somewhat disagree, actually. In most circumstances, it's better to use Ferrothorn, you're absolutely right. However, Forretress has a few tricks up its sleeve to distinguish itself:

1) Can Spin as well as set up its own hazards. I don't like the attitude people have that Defog eclipses Rapid Spin; it's simply not true. It's generally better to get rid of their hazards while still keeping yours. It just is, this is common sense. With Rapid Spin, you don't have to set up your hazards again and thus waste even more valuable turns, which is especially important for Spikes stacking. You're also not vulnerable to Taunt and Defiant at the cost of being spinblocked and making contact. You also don't need to use another slot to deal with hazard removal like you would with Ferrothorn, though this usually puts a lot of pressure on Forretress in the match. Still, it's there if you need to crunch teamslots for whatever reason.

2) Volt Switch for momentum. Still very cool, and eases prediction so you're not swapping blindly.

3) Slightly bulkier on the physical side. Not sure if it helps it survive anything specific, but Forretress has also got only one weakness, unlike Ferrothorn, at the cost of some resistances.

Sturdy's also situationally useful when you're at full health [not terribly likely, considering you're a spinner], to survive something to get up a crucial hazard, which can be helpful at times. RIP Custap Berry.

Either way, while I agree that Forretress is UU for a reason, that doesn't change the fact that it does have its own niche or two and isn't completely eclipsed.

[also, if you're gonna do calcs, use the same set for both, please - I'm pretty sure Physically Defensive is the standard Forretress set]
252+ Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Forretress: 102-121 (28.8 - 34.1%) -- 99.1% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 108-127 (30.6 - 36%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
[who the bloomin' hell uses Adamant Garchomp?]

4 Atk Forretress Gyro Ball (109 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Garchomp: 112-133 (31.2 - 37.1%) -- 81.9% chance to 3HKO
[not terrible all things considered]

I think I was clear with the advantages and disadvantages of using each, of course each pokemon is different so it has numerous advantages and disadvantages when compared to each pokemon. I did note the advantages of Rapid Spin and Volt Switch as well. Also, yes it is more physical defensive, but from what I've seen the mixed wall is the standard set, so all its EVs are in special defense and therefore indirectly lowering its defense. Also, you clearly misunderstand the point of the calcs... Its just a random pokemon that was shown to be the difference of a 3HKO and a 4HKO, not meant to be a common threat obviously. Also, regarding the offensive calc, it was shown to fairly show the differences and advantages of using Ferrothorn over Forretress. Again, every pokemon has its advantages, but I strongly believe that generally speaking, Ferrothorn outclasses Forretress.

 

[Eievui-Nymphia]

About forretress, I think that after the (more than likely) ban of the Deoxys formes, Forretress could be "barely viable" because, unlike Ferrothorn, it has Rapid Spin. If not, I think that if Aegislash (who has it's chances) were to get banned, it will be definitely viable.

I think that after those bans,
1) Teams with hazards will use more Rapid Spin than Defog. The reason is that user like Tyraniar, Garchomp, Terrakion are more difficult to put hazards again.
2) I think that a good portion of teams with Defog won't use hazards at all.
3) I think that many teams that don't have an obvious SR weakness won't use any method of removing hazards at all (mainly offensive teams).
4) I think that Stealth Rock will be least common on teams that is right now, although it will still be common, while Spikes will be rare in the metagame (skarmory doesn0t usually have Spikes, Ferrothorn can use the slot for other things).

 

[Pagoose]

Don't use:

Kabutops @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Waterfall
- Swords Dance
- Stone Edge

This set has limited coverage (Rock compliments water quite poorly) and is hard walled by several prominent walls in the metagame, such as Ferrothorn and Chesnaught. Kabutops has absolutely nothing to threaten them with, even after a Swords Dance, and Rain teams labor to get by Ferrothorn/Chesnaught as it is so simply "giving Kabutops support" to break down these walls isn't going to cut it. Aqua jet is absolutely terrible and is only used to hit Talonflame (which you beat anyway if you've preserved Kabutops as Brave Bird only does ~50%), Thundurus (which you kill 75% of the time anyway, though it does stop your sweep), and the rare Scarf Terrakion. The majority of the time, Kabutops will not need Aqua Jet as its ridiculous speed in the rain -- enough to outrun Deoxys-S -- allows it to outpace practically the entire metagame. So yeah, this is the set I keep seeing on the ladder and it's actually sad to see people run THIS set on a really damn good Pokemon.

Use this instead PLEASE:

Kabutops @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Superpower
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- Rapid Spin / Swords Dance

Superpower (or Low Kick if you'd prefer) enables Kabutops to badly wound Ferrothorn (or outright kill it after a Swords Dance boost) while putting a dent into Chesnaught on the switch, helping Kabutops' teammates wear it down later on in the match. Waterfall is still the main STAB move and hits like a truck under Rain, and Stone Edge bops Pokemon like Latias. This set largely eschews a small amount of its sweeping ability in exchange for dealing with its own checks FAR better...especially when the Pokemon that check Kabutops tend to annoy Rain as a whole. Perhaps Superpower will fall a little short of killing Ferrothorn, but Kingdra will appreciate the hole that has been busted open for it!

Another underrated aspect about Kabutops is its ability to spin. Aegislash and Sableye hate switching in on a Waterfall and Gengar flat out dies, so under Rain Kabutops does an outstanding job of pressuring spinblockers, albeit not quite as good a job as Excadrill. Because Rapid Spin isn't terribly common on Kabutops at the moment, your opponent might not even send in a spinblocker to protect their hazard(s), paving the way for a spin. Against HO teams, Kabutops will usually pay with its life to get a spin off so make sure you have a more established win condition if you choose to clear hazards. Against balance/stall it should have a far easier time spinning. Granted, Swords Dance is still a decent move on Kabutops since physically defensive Clefable and Quagsire are 2HKOed by Waterfall under rain anyway, so you don't have to worry about them walling you. Naturally, any Pokemon that lacks Unaware are going to be terrorized by a +2 Kabutops under rain. Be aware that Kabutops has a hard time setting up a Swords Dance and can often clean HO teams without boosting with its raw power. In summary, use Kabutops! Just please don't run the ladder set.

I used a rain team to get reqs last suspect test, so I think I have some experience. IMO The set should look like this:

Kabutops @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 28 HP / 252 Atk / 228 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Rapid Spin/Superpower/Swords Dance
- Stone Edge
- Waterfall
- Aqua Jet

These evs allow it to outspeed Deoxys-S, while giving it some extra bulk. It gets outsped by scarf Keldeo/Terrakion unless it runs jolly, so there is no reason to put those evs in speed except for outspeeding other Kabutops. I think Aqua jet is a staple and should be kept. Kabutops actually has pretty good coverage neutral coverage with its stabs; Waterfall and stone edge are only resisted by Keldeo, Ferrothorn, Breloom, and Chesnaught. This leaves it plently of room for aqua jet. Rain isn't always guaranteed, especially with all the sand teams everywhere. Aqua jet helps beat these teams, which always contains at least 2 water weaknesses, and is useful for beating many other weakened pokemon outside of rain, including Landorus, Gengar, Landorus-T, Diggersby, Mamoswine, and Thundurus and Talonflame inside of rain. It also allows it to beat Bisharp and Mega Mawile, 2 pokemon that tear through hyper offensive rain teams. Rapid Spin, Superpower, and Swords Dance all have merits. On my team I rain Gothitelle, so I didn't struggle against Ferrothorn, Chesnaught, or any of the other checks to rain. This allowed me to easily beat stall too, so I used swords dance before realising it got rapid spin, but the move you pick should depend on what your team struggles against. Superpower if you struggle against Ferrothorn, Swords dance if you struggle against stall (Most don't run Ferrothorn), and rapid spin otherwise.

 

[Anish]

true

 

[Mastoise]

Don't use icy wind, use hp ice http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-123462534 ~last turn of the game

 

[AM]

HP Ice doesn't allow you a speed drop that gives you a chance against things like Ddance Dragonite and the Lati twins, among the general benefits of dropping an opponents speed. Yeah that miss was unfortunate but that doesn't necessarily warrant hp ice as a superior option.

 

[ScraftyIsTheBest]

Um, no. Icy Wind is a much better option on Keldeo than Hidden Power Ice because the speed drop from it is just clutch. It allows Keldeo to surprise Latios on a switch-in, and it can fire another Icy Wind at it again since Icy Wind lowered Latios's speed. If Keldeo is to use a Hidden Power, it should always be Flying anyways, since this lets Keldeo do something against Mega Venusaur. Besides, the power difference between Icy Wind and Hidden Power Ice is very marginal.

As for that replay, it doesn't really matter and that doesn't justify not using Icy Wind on Keldeo. From what I can see in that replay, you were haxed beyond belief since almost all of your Pokemon suffered full paralysis, so that replay doesn't really prove anything other than that you had a match where the luck went completely against you (that said, Thundurus might be worthy of a suspect test in the future).

Finally, that really isn't the purpose of this thread. The purpose of this thread is to outline bad sets or bad Pokemon that are commonly seen on the ladder, and to suggest better alternatives (for example, Thundurus>Jolteon, etc.). If you do plan on making a "Don't Use This, Use That" post, you must show the sets and elaborate on why such a set is bad and the alternative is better.

Just a point.

 

[Boltaway]

I disagree on that idea that Keldeo should be using HP Flying always or that it's objectively better.

For example, HP Electric makes it amazing against regular Gyarados, who otherwise walls its STABs. Last gen, Keldeo ran HP Ghost for Jellicent and HP Bug for Celebi. In all of these cases, Keldeo should run Hidden Power solely to dismantle would-be counters/checks. This isn't an argument of coverage or of what's actually better, but rather what Keldeo needs for that specific team.

For example, if you're running Nasty Plot HP Flying Thundurus, you can deal with Amoongus and Venusaur rather easily, or weaken them (Specs Hydro from Keldeo + HP Flying from LO Thundy + SR = dead Venusaur) and thus HP Flying is a redundant and pointless coverage for a lure that you don't need. Likewise, if you had Keldeo on a birdspam team, you'd rather use HP Electric since certain Gyarados builds can do pretty well against that archetype.

Also, make sure you're using Secret Sword, not Sacred Sword. Can't tell you how many times I've made that mistake in teambuilder lol
and then wondering why it only did 27% to ferrothorn

 

[MilkyWay]

Hidden Power Ice is better on Scarf Keldeo than Icy Wind because the speed drop wont matter as only priority will outspeed it anyways. However, on pretty much every other Keldeo set Icy Wind is the way to go.

 

[CyclicCompound]

Hidden Power Ice is better on Scarf Keldeo than Icy Wind because the speed drop wont matter as only priority will outspeed it anyways. However, on pretty much every other Keldeo set Icy Wind is the way to go.

I would argue the opposite. Knock Off is not only a very prevalent move but also one that Keldeo easily switches in on. If Scarf Keldeo loses its item, which is certainly not an unlikely scenario, the 5 base power drop is definitely worth the speed drop.

 

[escarlata]

And so one fine day when I was laddering at the 17xxs, I Baton Passed on an obvious switch. My opponent's remark was: "Why use BP when Celebi learns U-turn?" I decided to check the movepool usage in the official stats and realised Baton Pass has less usage than U-turn at 1500s and 1695s. Even in 1825, there is a good 26.878% of Celebi using U-turn, and by movepool usage stats, I doubt all the users of U-turn were using Leaf Storm. In short...
Don't use this:

Celebi @ Leftovers
Ability: Nature Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
Calm Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Recover
- Giga Drain / Psychic
- U-turn

Why it's bad: One word: Pursuit. Yes, U-turn on Celebi has no way to escape Pursuit, which is really damn relevant considering the whole reason to use SDef Celebi is to check the handful of special attackers like Keldeo, Landorus, Thundurus, Rotom-W, which just so happens to paired with Pursuit trappers, like Bisharp, Ttar, Scizor etc. Once said threats come in, Celebi has to rely on 50/50s to get out alive, and so aforesaid special attackers become capable of blowing holes in your team with their check removed. Losing Celebi to common teammates of what you are supposed to check defeats the point of using SDef Celebi in the first place. To allow Celebi to be more reliably fulfill its designated role...

Instead, use this:

Celebi @ Leftovers
Ability: Nature Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
Calm Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Recover
- Giga Drain / Psychic
- Baton Pass

Why it's better: While U-turn is capable of dealing random chip damage, its damage is pretty pathetic against anything which you actually want to deal chip damage to. Baton Pass on the other hand, allows you to safely escape any Pursuit trapper easily. This makes Celebi a more reliable switch-in to Keldeo, Rotom-w etc because you don't have to fear a potential double switch into their Pursuit trapper since Baton Pass avoids Pursuit damage.

 

[MQJinx]

30% of all Greninja are using this *facepalm*

Don't use:

Greninja @ Life Orb / Leftovers / Assault Vest / Sitrus Berry
Ability: Protean
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Extrasensory
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Grass / Dark Pulse

Just... no. Scald is one of the worst moves you could possibly run on Greninja. It is too frail to make use of the burn chance. Besides, Hidden Power Grass or Grass Knot is enough if you want to pester Azumarill. You also give up a significant amount of power for something that most of the time doesn't help. Defensive sets in general are bad for Greninja because it is so frail to the point that any defensive boost wouldn't matter in the end. If you want your Scald, use Quagsire, Suicune, or Slowbro, as they actually have bulk to make full use of the burn from Scald.

Use this instead:

Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 4 Def (or 4 Atk) / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Timid / Naive Nature
IVs: 0 Atk (disregard for U-turn)
- Hydro Pump
- Extrasensory
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Grass / Grass Knot / U-turn

This is the tried-and-true Greninja set that makes it a threat in the first place. Greninja is best used as a revenge killer or a late-game cleaner, not a "bulky" attacker, and Hydro Pump STAB makes this possible by packing power to threaten a lot of mons. Overall this set has a larger impact on opposing teams than Scald Greninja and is much more threatening, and should always be considered when using Greninja.

 

[tutterydiglett]

30% of all Greninja are using this *facepalm*

Don't use:

Greninja @ Life Orb / Leftovers / Assault Vest / Sitrus Berry
Ability: Protean
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Extrasensory
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power Fire / Hidden Power Grass / Dark Pulse

Just... no. Scald is one of the worst moves you could possibly run on Greninja. It is too frail to make use of the burn chance. Besides, Hidden Power Grass is enough if you want to pester Azumarill. You also give up a significant amount of power for something that most of the time doesn't help. Defensive sets in general are bad for Greninja because it is so frail to the point that any defensive boost wouldn't matter in the end. If you want your Scald, use Rotom-W, Quagsire, Suicune, or Slowbro, as they actually have bulk to make full use of the burn from Scald.

Rotom-W

 

[skies]

MQJinx, I completely disagree with all of that. Scald's not used primarily for power (on sweepers), but more so for the burn chance, enhancing their not-so-good bulk and slowly wearing down threats to make them easier to beat. Sure, Hydro Pump is great, but Scald is still strong, 100% accurate, and wears down Pokemon, so they don't get a free switch in. Certainly not a bad option at all. Better yet, I'd make it with Don't use: Dark Pulse, it provides nothing really and isn't necessary by any means at all.

 

[midend]

MQJinx, I completely disagree with all of that. Scald's not used primarily for power (on sweepers), but more so for the burn chance, enhancing their not-so-good bulk and slowly wearing down threats to make them easier to beat. Sure, Hydro Pump is great, but Scald is still strong, 100% accurate, and wears down Pokemon, so they don't get a free switch in. Certainly not a bad option at all. Better yet, I'd make it with Don't use: Dark Pulse, it provides nothing really and isn't necessary by any means at all.

With aegi gone, dark pulse hits...slowbro? Alakakakazam? Gengar?
Nah i agree it's not enough to warrant a moveslot.

 

[Talpr0ne]

Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Extrasensory
- Ice Beam
- Dark Pulse

Wtf this move got 42.718% usage in oususpect1630, where the sole reason this move should have ever been considered, Aegislash, was unaviable.
People are probably hyped about Dark Pulse because it gives good neutral coverage, but on something as frail and not so strong as Greninja you often need to strike threats for supereffective damage, and Hydro Pump gives you all the neutral coverage you need anyway.
Let's see what Dark Pulse hits for supereffective damage; Psychic and Ghost types. Ghost types are very, very rare nowadays, like seriously, there are only Gengar, which is weak to Extrasensory anyway, and Sableye which is not even weak to Dark. Other very niche ghost types such as Chandelure, Jellicent and Gourgeist are hit harder by other moves such as Hydro Pump, Grass Knot and Ice Beam, respectively.
Psychic types are much more common, but, again, they can be dealt with other coverage moves; Alakazam is ohkoed by Hydro Pump after a smigden of prior damage and always ohkoed by U-turn, and it also outspeeds you if mega, so it might be a better idea to run, the Eons and Celebi are weak to Ice Beam, Victini is weak to Hydro Pump, Slowbro and Starmie are weak to Grass Knot, while Jirachi and Bronzong are weak to Hidden Power Fire, although they take a little less damage, and Mew takes a fuckton from U-turn. Gardevoir and Medicham, probably among the most common Psychic types right now, aren't even weak to Dark Pulse. This leaves only Cresselia as a realistic target for Dark Pulse, which, needless to say, isn't enough to warrant a moveslot.

Use this instead:

Greninja @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe - 4 Atk / 252 Satk / 252 Spe
Timid Nature/ Naive Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Extrasensory
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power Fire / Grass Knot / Hidden Power Grass / U-Turn

These four slashed attacks deal with a much larger portion of the metagame than Dark Pulse even could. Hidden Power Fire reliably covers Scizor and Ferrothorn; Grass Knot hits very hard most Water types such as Gyarados, Suicune, Azumarill and Slowbro, and also hits Tyranitar harder than any other move; HP Grass can be used if Rotom-W is a concern, but you will lose power against other Water Types; finally U-turn allows to gain momentum and hit decently hard Pokémon weak to Bug.

 

[WebBowser]

What do you think of HP elec on greninja? Gives you a bolt-beamish type thing which is kinda cool.

 

[trc]

Hidden Power Electric is pretty bad since BoltBeam coverage isn't all that great on a Pokemon that attains such amazing coverage anyway, though it could see use in a counterteam for someone going to bring Mantine or SpD Gyarados (literally the only reason I can think of lol).

 

[alexwolf]

MQJinx, I completely disagree with all of that. Scald's not used primarily for power (on sweepers), but more so for the burn chance, enhancing their not-so-good bulk and slowly wearing down threats to make them easier to beat. Sure, Hydro Pump is great, but Scald is still strong, 100% accurate, and wears down Pokemon, so they don't get a free switch in. Certainly not a bad option at all. Better yet, I'd make it with Don't use: Dark Pulse, it provides nothing really and isn't necessary by any means at all.

Actually, Dark Pulse is an ok option to get past Slowbro, Mew, Cresselia, and bulky Starmie while being able to use Hidden Power Fire over Grass to deal with Ferrothorn and SpD Mega Scizor. Missing on coverage against Keldeo sucks, but it's not like there aren't Pokemon to deal with this. Nothing special but not unviable.

 

[midend]

Actually, Dark Pulse is an ok option to get past Slowbro, Mew, Cresselia, and bulky Starmie while being able to use Hidden Power Fire over Grass to deal with Ferrothorn and SpD Mega Scizor. Missing on coverage against Keldeo sucks, but it's not like there aren't Pokemon to deal with this. Nothing special but not unviable.

Extrasensory gets keldeo though

 

[alexwolf]

Extrasensory gets keldeo though

I was talking about the combo of Dark Pulse + Hidden Power Fire.

 

[midend]

I was talking about the combo of Dark Pulse + Hidden Power Fire.

That is true...
I also observe that dark pulse seems to leave gren weak to mach punch and enemy scarfed u-turn, and that's scary considering that if greninja is forced out it cannot afford to u-turn on its own on that turn, limiting the effectiveness of its own set when it is dark type.
I suppose the same goes for ice beam, but meh ice beam nails so much more than dark pulse it's worth that moveslot anyway

 

[The Bravest Bird]

Don't use this please:

Clefable @ Leftovers / Toxic Orb / Flame Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Cosmic Power
- Charge Beam
- Stored Power
- Soft-Boiled

About 29% of all clefable run cosmic power. The problem with Cosmic Power Clefable is how long it takes to set up, leaving plenty of time for the opponent to phase it out, taunt, trick you a scarf, or at least crit. Not only this, it hits like wet toilet paper before setting up. You also lack ways to beat steels before setting up. Charge Beam doesn't even increase Special Attack all the time, increasing how long you need to set up. Charge Beam's low BP also means that Steel types and Dark types of all things can come in on Stored Power and phase or try to muscle through.
this set is also walled by krookodile, 0/10

Instead, use this:

Clefable @ Leftovers / Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 SpD
Calm Nature
- Calm Mind
- Soft-Boiled
- Moonblast
- Flamethrower / Stored Power

Calm Mind Clefable is infinitely better for several reasons. First of all, you actually have a STAB to work with before you set up. Clefable is also able to hit steels such as Ferrothorn, Scizor and Skarmory with Flamethrower, or it can opt for Stored Power to have an easier time muscling through Mega Venusaur and Heatran, while also beating Chansey and Unaware mons. Clefable has the ability to be a win condition in many matches, whether vs. stall or offense(though it has a bit of a harder time setting up vs offense). Calm Mind also boosts its special attack 100% of the time, rather than relying on a chance from charge beam.

 

[pj]

Don't use this please:
Clefable @ Leftovers / Toxic Orb / Flame Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Cosmic Power
- Charge Beam
- Stored Power
- Soft-Boiled

About 29% of all clefable run cosmic power. The problem with Cosmic Power Clefable is how long it takes to set up, leaving plenty of time for the opponent to phase it out, taunt, trick you a scarf, or at least crit. Not only this, it hits like wet toilet paper before setting up. You also lack ways to beat steels before setting up. Charge Beam doesn't even increase Special Attack all the time, increasing how long you need to set up. Charge Beam's low BP also means that Steel types and Dark types of all things can come in on Stored Power and phase or try to muscle through.
this set is also walled by krookodile, 0/10

Instead, use this:
Clefable @ Leftovers / Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 SpD
Calm Nature
- Calm Mind
- Soft-Boiled
- Moonblast
- Flamethrower / Stored Power

Calm Mind Clefable is infinitely better for several reasons. First of all, you actually have a STAB to work with before you set up. Clefable is also able to hit steels such as Ferrothorn, Scizor and Skarmory with Flamethrower, or it can opt for Stored Power to have an easier time muscling through Mega Venusaur and Heatran, while also beating Chansey and Unaware mons. Clefable has the ability to be a win condition in many matches, whether vs. stall or offense(though it has a bit of a harder time setting up vs offense). Calm Mind also boosts its special attack 100% of the time, rather than relying on a chance from charge beam.

just a small suggestion try using this EV spread
EVs: 252 HP /252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold nature

with this EV spread you can withstand Gyro ball 4hko
4 Atk Ferrothorn Power Whip vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 109-129 (27.6 - 32.7%) -- 72.4% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
which makes it physically defense Strong and since its going to do Calm Mind it Special defense will raise itself