Other Critical Hits

[Aerodactyl Legend]

Apparently, there has been a nerf to Critical Hits. Instead of doing twice the amount of damage, the damage is now multiplied by only 1.5. This is a rather big change when you think about it and brings up multiple points:

-This basically weakens the effects of moves that have an increased CH precentage, such as Stone Edge. While the 100 base power is why you would use it, the increased percentage was a nice bonus before.

-Any "strategy" revolving around utilizing Critical Hits are weakened. Relying on Critical Hits was never a good way to go anyways, and now it's even worse because you're setting up stuff that will no longer do significant damage.

-You can't break through Def and SpD increases as easy as before.

-A Pokemon using instant recovery can very well survive an assault even if a crit happens (no more "Crit-fishing").

-It's another effort in limiting the offensive power this generation.

-Somewhat takes care of the gamebreaking hax crits.​

I'm not really sure I like this. While the BS hax "nerf" is nice, 1.5 seems a little insignificant in regards to something happening (supposedly) 6.25% of the time. I think they would have been better off just lowering the neutral percentage and tinkering with the abilities/moves/items that affect it.

 

[Fundance]

You're forgetting according to some, crit rate up moves were reportedly buffed as well this gen. Focus energy now supposedly makes non-crit rate attacks crit at something akin to a 50% chance, wheras a Farfetch'd wielding a Stick and using Slash will crit almost 100% of the time.

At least that's what they were saying over at the data collection and game mechanics thread.

 

[Aerodactyl Legend]

You're forgetting according to some, crit rate up moves were reportedly buffed as well this gen. Focus energy now supposedly makes non-crit rate attacks crit at something akin to a 50% chance, wheras a Farfetch'd wielding a Stick and using Slash will crit almost 100% of the time.

Ah, didn't catch that. Gonna take a quick look there. It still would be a bad idea to use FE though. You'd burn a moveslot and turn up for an effect that wouldn't always happen.

 

[Chou Toshio]

Could someone please post a viable source for these claims? Otherwise, I will close the thread.

edit: To clarify, I'll give it some time to see if anyone can verify. If it's true, it's definitely worth discussing.

 

[Aerodactyl Legend]

Could someone please post a viable source for these claims? Otherwise, I will close the thread.

Nothing solid from what I see. Several mentions in threads (including the Stall thread), so it's still sort of in the dark. No objections on it being closed if needed, it's still early at this point.

 

[Grey Knight]

Could someone please post a viable source for these claims? Otherwise, I will close the thread.

well i think that critical hits got nerfed , i noticed while spamming dragon tail with druddigon, but nerfing also makes sense since all the auto crit moves got buffed to 60.
(B/W)storm throw=40*2=60*1,5=~(X/Y)storm throw

 

[Haruno]

It's hard to verify anything that is purely statistical without achieving a sample size. Though if crit enchancing moves did indeed get buffed then it'll definitely be worth using since if focus energy really does increase critical hit rates to 50% then it's effectively a 1.25x damage increase over time.

 

[Thorhammer]

Just from basic ingame play I can confirm that the damage was nerfed.

Interesting about the auto-crit moves like Storm Throw; they've been buffed from 40>80 to 60>90.

 

[DDRMaster]

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/pokémon-battle-mechanics-research.3489239/page-18#post-4896133

Critical hits now do anywhere from x1.4 to x1.651 damage. My guess is it's x1.5, like everyone's been saying.

 

[supermarth64]

Critical hits ignored Def/SpD boosts but that's more relevant to if you were hitting a boosted Pokemon with a neutral move.

 

[Wendrika]

Competitively, does this mean that being "haxxed" won't be as big of an issue as it was in past generations? We can get criticals more often but do less with each critical. Does this balances it out?

 

[Bummer]

Competitively, does this mean that being "haxxed" won't be as big of an issue as it was in past generations? We can get criticals more often but do less with each critical. Does this balances it out?

We'll still get haxed. Crits will still bypass boosts to the defense, and thus make for a unlikely turn of events, which in turn is a hax. And even though a x1.5 increase is smaller than x2, we'll still assume what ranges our mons can survive in battle, which crits still affect. Granted, the scope is more narrow than before, but it's still substantial.

So yeah. We'll have angry n00bs for years to come.

 

[Super Mario Bro]

Competitively, does this mean that being "haxxed" won't be as big of an issue as it was in past generations? We can get criticals more often but do less with each critical. Does this balances it out?

I did not hear anything about this. How often do crits land now?

 

[Mattman324]

I did not hear anything about this. How often do crits land now?

In BASIC, we don't, but when things like Night Slash, Scope Lens (for all that's good for), and the Stick come into account, the crit rate CHANGES.

Supposedly Farfetch'd with a Stick and a high crit move (and he gets all the good ones but Stone Edge iirc) has a 100% chance of crits.

 

[Wendrika]

I did not hear anything about this. How often do crits land now?

I've heard just rumors here and there, including mentions that some moves with increased critical rates got buffed. So I just assumed. If a move like Slash has increased critical rate, having it do less critical damage should balance it out, I think. That's what I'm talking about though, not an overall increase in critical rate across the board.

Quite a shame it won't help improve the fair play and etiquette.

 

[MegaKick]

Doesn't pokemon amie raise crit rate? What if this increased crit rate people have been claiming is due to pokemon-amie and not changed battle mechanics?

 

[AstralFire]

Doesn't pokemon amie raise crit rate? What if this increased crit rate people have been claiming is due to pokemon-amie and not changed battle mechanics?

No, it's not due to Pokemon-Amie. Testers have either used no affection mons or done it via Wi-Fi. Basic crit rate is the same as before, Focus Energy, Stick, and moves with increased crit chance have much more consistent benefits than before.

 

[LastFootnote]

According to my tests, it is extremely likely that the base crit rate is still 1/16. In addition, the crit rate with a high-crit move and no other boosts still appears to be 1/8. I do not have a Scope Lens, Razor Claw, or a Pokémon with Super Luck yet, so I can't speak for those at this time.

A Farfetch'd with a Stick or a Pokémon that has used Focus Energy will crit 1/2 of the time. Such a Pokémon using a high-crit move will ALWAYS crit unless the target is immune to crits. Not "almost always". Always. ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS. My Farfetch'd with a Stick has NEVER not crit when using a high-crit move except against a Corphish with Shell Armor. And I've had it in my party for the entire game.

So crits got nerfed for most Pokémon, but they're much more consistent for crit specialists.

 

[anubite]

Oh wow. That's amazing news. Farfetch'd might be fun at NU now.

Also, I was thinking of doing a focus energy Gangaskhan build... if you attack twice you could really devastate somebody. He also gets shadow claw.

 

[Icy_eagle]

I think it would be worth checking out how super luck and night slash works out for honckrow and absol. If it always results in crits, they've basically become 105 BP moves (157 with STAB) that hit through defense boosts.

 

[LastFootnote]

I think it would be worth checking out how super luck and night slash works out for honckrow and absol. If it always results in crits, they've basically become 105 BP moves (157 with STAB) that hit through defense boosts.

I'm guessing that combo won't reach 100% crit rate, even with a Scope Lens, but I could be wrong. You'll probably need Focus Energy or a Lansat Berry to get enough crit stages.

 

[Icy_eagle]

I'm guessing that combo won't reach 100% crit rate, even with a Scope Lens, but I could be wrong. You'll probably need Focus Energy or a Lansat Berry to get enough crit stages.

Well, prior to gen 6 focus energy and stick gave +2 to critical hit while super luck gave +1. Assuming things work somewhat similarly you'd need scope lens for a 100% crit rate for high crit-moves. Either way, things need to be tested more. :)

 

[LastFootnote]

Well, prior to gen 6 focus energy and stick gave +2 to critical hit while super luck gave +1. Assuming things work somewhat similarly you'd need scope lens for a 100% crit rate for high crit-moves. Either way, things need to be tested more. :)

Well, many things could be at play here. It's possible that Stick and Focus Energy just give 4 crit stages now, and there's a new stage with 100% rate once you get 5 stages. It's also possible that 100% crits happen at 4 or fewer stages. But unless either Super Luck or Scope Lens gives more than 1 stage, you can still only get to 3 stages with a combination of Super Luck, Scope Lens, and a high-crit move. And I really doubt that 3 stages gives you 100% crit rate. That would mean that the crit rate went from 1/16 to 1/8 to 1/2 to 1/1. That's quite a gap in the middle. I'm guessing that Focus Energy et al just give more than 2 stages now.

 

[Super Mario Bro]

According to my tests, it is extremely likely that the base crit rate is still 1/16. In addition, the crit rate with a high-crit move and no other boosts still appears to be 1/8. I do not have a Scope Lens, Razor Claw, or a Pokémon with Super Luck yet, so I can't speak for those at this time.

A Farfetch'd with a Stick or a Pokémon that has used Focus Energy will crit 1/2 of the time. Such a Pokémon using a high-crit move will ALWAYS crit unless the target is immune to crits. Not "almost always". Always. ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS. My Farfetch'd with a Stick has NEVER not crit when using a high-crit move except against a Corphish with Shell Armor. And I've had it in my party for the entire game.

So crits got nerfed for most Pokémon, but they're much more consistent for crit specialists.

I see. Just curious, but do you also happen to know whether or not crits still ignore stat boosts?

 

[Manaphy]

I am actually a HUGE fan of critical hits doing less. It means Crits will impact the game less, while also leaving Calm Mind wars for example with a winner. It's also a huge boon to stall because getting a Critical Hit is often a deciding factor in games with stall.