Pokémon Alola Ninetales

[pika pal]

When is a Rapid Spin user has no reliable Recovery and a mediocre match up against most Stealth rock users ever a good idea? Doubly so when the typing is garbage even OUTSIDE the rocks? And the point being made is that the entire appeal of Aurora Veil is getting both screens in ONE action. Sandslash adds an additional action to the chain, because rather than Ninetales -> Aurora, the sequence becomes Ninetales -> Sandslash -> Aurora Veil.

The reasoning you provide is that Slash can be a back up setter, but Ninetales isn't a mon that has nearly as hard a time setting Veil a second time, because it's natural speed is actually good and it sets its own Hail. Sandslash needs Ninetales to have been on the field recently enough for hail to be present, and then has to make it onto the field with enough threat to force out the thing it's veiling on. Whether or not Ninetales is "easy" or "hard" to set the Veil with, Sandslash is objectively more difficult and inefficient to do so, in particular because the stacking weaknesses mean that most of Ninetales' answers will probably deal with him about as well. Given how Aurora Veil works, if you get it set once, you should have a sweeper able to break so much of the opponent's team that they can't keep momentum away from a Ninetales re-entry after their team's half dead. His coverage is garbage, he gets Walled by Bulky Waters like Tapu Fini (who proceeds to remove your screens and your Rocks along with theirs), or Manaphy who proceeds to set up Tail Glow/Z-Rain Dance (or BOTH given this thing) in your face and then murders your team. It also can't hit non-grounded Steels like Celesteela, who Automotizes in your face, or throws out some Leech Seeds to stall out your Hail, Magearna can Shift Gear on you to reach Speed tie with Max/Max (outspeeds this variant here even in Hail) and Aura Sphere/Fleur Cannon through your bulky attackers. Sandslash also becomes set up fodder for BU Buzzwole, and Defensive Mega Venusaur can stall out with Synthesis EVEN UNDER HAIL, or just kill you

252 Atk Sandslash-Alola Icicle Crash vs. 248 HP / 96+ Def Thick Fat Venusaur-Mega: 84-98 (23.1 - 26.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after hail damage
0 SpA Venusaur-Mega Hidden Power Fire vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Sandslash-Alola through Light Screen: 146-174 (50.1 - 59.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

This thing's damage is too pathetic to create chances for it to veil or to rapid spin hazards away, Ninetales gets away with it because it takes minimum conditional building, its speed tier is fast enough unaided to set up, Freeze Dry stops it from being totally passive shit against Tapu Fini or Pelipper, who are the best at removing/preventing its screens, and while not good, its typing still affords it a resistance or two that let it get the set up turn it needs for the Veil. Also, Encore is important for Ninetales because it doesn't have the power to break things, so it discourages setting up on it while it sets the Veil.

The entire appeal of Aurora Veil, as I said, is the speed of getting the two screens up so that a sweeper can get in and rampage. Suicide setters in previous gens were popular because they were an easy way to get them up early game once. Ninetales gets them up in fewer turns, and creates momentum almost as well by threatening Encore. Sandslash's set has you trying to give it more utility alongside Aurora Veil, when what a mon needs is options that FACILITATE Aurora Veil. That move is powerful enough to make an otherwise shit mon viable in Ninetales, and that's only because it has Snow Warning to completely ignore the obvious inhibition of the move. When you reach the point of needing another Aurora Veil setter, when the entire appeal is one mon being able to set both screens with it reliably, on its own, for others to sweep, then you're either not playing Aurora Veil well or against a team where you'll only fare worse for using Alolan Sandslash in any manner.

Alolan Sandslash is garbage in OU. Hell, Alolan Ninetales is garbage in OU for anything besides Aurora Veil, it just happens it's the one "good" user of a move that is very obviously stupid good. This discussion is maybe one step above the Merciless/Venoshock Toxapex I saw earlier.



Can we get back to discussing uses for Alolan Ninetales that prove relevant? What kind of sweepers do you think it pairs with well, offensive "blitzkreig" sweepers like DD M-Gyarados or Shift Gear Magearna, or bulky win conditions like BU Tapu Bulu/Buzzwole and Coil Zygarde? With the latter type, they're most at risk early when trying to accrue their boosts, so protection for those turns seems ideal, especially with Zygarde who can become nigh unkillable but lacks reliable recovery to support stacking multiple boosts until perhaps very late game.

 

[M BLADE]

Instead of wasting effort with two Aurora Veil users, if you really want to use 2 mons to set up "screens" why not use the another mon for the traditional screens (Reflect/Light Screen)? They stack with each other after all.
I still believe it's not the greatest idea but hey, double screens is basically a +4 on defenses for a limited time. If you need offensive pressure try Dual Screens Serperior; due to Contrary Leaf Storm Serperior is a rare case where it can sweep and support at the same time if needed.

Anyway, Charizard-X in my opionion is a pretty good for A-Tales. Both share rock weakness, but everthing else is covered (well, kinda). A defensive DD set with Aurora Veil up means Char is pretty hard to take down.
Have a answer for Heatran/Toxapex tough. Tapu Fini can only take defensive Char-X down with Taunt so that's a plus.

 

[Martin]

Just because you make your points in a rude and blunt fashion doesn't make them good.

Sorry if it came across as rude; I don't mean for it to come across like that. Its just that being v. forward+blunt is the only way you can really get a point like this across to a lot of people on the internet, and given the excess of posts about Alolan Sandslash in this thread it's become a conditioned response to posts involving it.

Mega Metagross is everywhere currently and completely counters Ninetales, as do many OU mons (Scizor, Magearna, Celesteela, etc). If you read what I said, I said that it is not trivial to set Aurora Veil more than once - which it isn't. I wouldn't say it's incredibly difficult to set more than once, but super duper easy it isn't, and so a second screen setter does make that process trivial.

Why are you trying to set on Mega Metagross in the first place lol? Same goes for all of these things that counter Ninetales lol. Also no you didn't say that; I can literally quote your original post (i.e. the one I was commenting on; I didn't read the other guy's response or your response to him, so if you said something different in that then that'd explain it): you say it's tricky, with tricky being a synonym of hard/difficult/etc..

A-Ninetales in my experience can be a little tricky to set Aurora Veil with itself due to its many weaknesses, and of course it's rocks weak so it appreciates Defog/Rapid Spin support.

In addition, you don't realistically ever need more than one setter; Ninetales doesn't get overwhelmed by the role, and only ever realistically need to set it when you're bringing out a wallbreaker/sweeper or preparing to pivot into one, and 8 turns is more than enough for it to put a dent in your opponent and for you to set up another situation where setting again is a piece of cake. That and the types of teams you run Alolan Tales work quick enough and are aggressive enough that a secondary setter is rendered a wasted team slot. Also, yes, it is super duper easy to set two or three times per game provided you aren't playing Ninetales inefficiently. The "provided you are playing completely awfully" from my post was less an attack on you and more an attack on this misconception because I am sick of people using that as their reasoning in more contexts than just this despite it just being plain false.

But thanks for undermining my ability as a player, even though I don't really think you read what I said properly in the first place - i.e. I never said setting Aurora Veil was incredibly difficult.

Once again, I apologise for coming across as rude and, once again, I didn't mean to undermine you, so sorry for that too.

It takes two turns, one where you auto-hail and one where you bring the secondary Aurora Veil user in (if not Slash, then Mew, as it doesn't share Ninetales' weaknesses and so a manual switch is more reasonable).

you should never have to spend two turns to set something like this up; at that point it is the same as setting up both screens, which doesn't take two team slots to achieve. In fact, it is actively slower than Dual Screens in a lot of scenarios because you need 3 turns: 1) bring out Ninetales, 2) bring out Sandslash, 3) set Aurora Veil.

You say it's (a) unreliable, why? There's not many weather pokemon that want to be switching into Ninetales (only Zard-Y after it has mega evolved), so having hail up for 2-3 turns is IMO in no way an un-reliable phenomenon. All you have to do is get that pokemon out at some point if a few turns time.

Unreliable is prolly not the right word here, but what I meant is two things. The fact that you need to have sent Ninetales out within five turns of it going up means that planning for it is not as easy as it is on paper, and going to Ninetales first gives your opponent a turn to switch out before hand--making it a huge momentum sap. This is not ideal at all.

You say it's (b) inefficient, and sure you're right it is. But you're missing the point, it's a secondary setter providing additional utility with Rapid Spin also. You are still supposed to set Aurora Veil with Ninetales, but hypothetically let's paint a situation. You and your opponent have three pokemon left, and you end up with Ninetales against Mega Metagross. Ninetales has set hail, so even though it gets the OHKO from Metagross, your secondary setter can now set Aurora Veil - allowing whatever you had in slot three to set up even though the odds looked unfavourable.

That's extremely specific, granted I respect it's an example, but it doesn't change the fact that these types of teams a) don't have room for 2 setters and b) have no need to. (I'm repeating myself here but the point still stands.)

Or better yet, your opponent had a surprise scarf and OHKOed Ninetales. You now have an opportunity to easily set AV and then set up with something else, as there's little Slash can't outspeed. The point is, the secondary setter is opening more opportunities to set Aurora Veil that you didn't have previously.

Aside from Lele there are basically no common scarfers that are slower than Slash, rendering this point moot for the most part.

You say it's (c) outclassed by ordinary screens, I really wouldn't say that's true. Yes, hail has to be in effect, but all that means is Ninetales has to be out a single turn and then you have 4 turns to secondary set. As mentioned, bringing in additional weather doesn't happen much in practice as Ninetales deals with them well already, so setting Aurora Veil inside of those turns isn't a problem. To me, it edges conventional screens as they take two turns to set (literally providing your opponent a free switch if you insist on both) and they don't expire on the same turn - giving a one turn disparity in your defences which, while not awful, still is worse than when the effects go away at the same time.

It's not outclassed if Ninetales is the one setting it, but the for non-Snow Warning setters it is; you don't always set up both screens--you set what's relevant to what you're trying to deal with. If you set both, it is typically because they doubled out on your first screen; as such, you attain the same goal without the momentum drop caused by you being the double switcher.

You've already covered these points elsewhere, as have I in previous posts, so your comment here was pointless. Rapid Spin/Revenge-killing and cleaning/opening up more opportunities to set AV that differ to the opportunities that Ninetales in does not strike me as redundant or terrible, and though the role is filled by a partner it doesn't hurt to have something secondary filling that role as well as others (teams that have two Taunt users, etc.).

Repeating for effect+emphasis; also, if you have two of something on a team it indicates there is a necessity for it, whether it is to patch up a specific weakness (2 Taunters patch up Stall weakness, for example) or to allow for an archetype to achieve its goal (T-wave spam, typespam etc.). Aurora Veil/Screens offense doesn't need 2 Screeners to function, and it doesn't help it patch up any specific weakness--making it redundant.

SD+3 Atks has poor mileage given that an Aurora Veil Ninetales needs to hold Light Clay and not an Icy Rock to make good use of Aurora Veil. Further, the typing doesn't exactly lend itself to a set-up turn. With the high speed tier, the suggested Slash set is doing something (setting Veil mostly without fail against fast mons) which as you point out the hard walled SD set rarely does.

This is the whole reason why hail stinks btw. The issue is that the types of teams you would run SD Sandslash on (you shouldn't, but if you did for some awful reason) is that they don't use Light Clay on Ninetales specifically because of this. The argument is that you only need Veil for enough turns to get Slash in, and that generally you'd go to Slash p. much immediately after Ninetales or you'd pivot into it within 2-3 turns--allowing you to retain the Veil.

You're completely right, I can't 2HKO it, what I can do is OHKO it and outspeed it at the +1:

252 Atk Sandslash-Alola Rock Slide vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Volcarona: 388-460 (124.7 - 147.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

I think you got a little caught up in the vigorous nay-saying to engage your brain.

I was using the listed moves, which lack Rock Slide; that said, saccing EQ sounds really iffy because without EQ you are walled by all Steel-types in a meta where Steel-types are fucking everywhere, making it inefficient.

Ninetales outspeeds Zard-X, so even if you can't take a hit from it you can set Aurora Veil, which is fine late game as it puts X massively on the back foot. Slash doesn't have a reliance on its speed and hail to necessarily Rapid Spin all the time, and as I mentiuest User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Moption to set itself. And sure, Mamoswine and Weavile are better and faster revenge killers, but they don't revenge kill and offer utility. Plenty of people run Rapid Spin on Sand Rush Excadrill with TTar, whose speed tier is similar - really how is that any different?

I'm not sure if I'm understanding part of this correctly due to ur browser bugging or smth idk, but if I am understanding "as I mentiuest User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Moption to set itself." correctly in that it's in reference to using Hail, then running Hail involves sacrificing coverage, which makes you hella easy to take advantage of. Charizard is still a big deal because if you set veil as it comes in you can't encore turn 1, die turn 2 and you still have to deal with a +1 Spe Zard, which by the time your opp sends it to set up means that your team is weakened to the point that +1 Spe is the more important part. Excadrill is faster, stronger, has better typing and is more consistent in the role of spinner; it's also not trying to do something that involves sacrificing its ability to perform the role compression that the set aims to achieve--if you try to do too much in one team slot, it reduces efficiency in areas it's better suited to. Alolan Sandslash with Spin+3 attacks would be fine compression because its not trying to bite off more than will reduce efficiency beyond all reasonable levels due to moveset restrictions; you need 3 attacks to avoid being unnecessarily restricted offensively. Aurora Veil+3 Attacks would also be better, but at that point you have to wonder whether it's worth it, considering that--once again--there is no reason to use two Aurora Veil users on one team given the nature of said teams.

Well it's rude, belligerent and unpleasant people like you who sustain me and give me the will to go on. Have a nice day.

Third time in this post, but once again I'm sorry for coming across as rude/unpleasant. It wasn't my immediate intention, and in hindsight some of the comments were a little harsh/badly worded; I apologise.

 

[Lemon Ginger]

I think this thread can be easily summarized as follows:

• Ninetales is mediocre
• Aurora veil is borderline broken
• Hail and its users are mediocre at best
• Ice types are bad

If Ninetales didn't have Aurora veil + snow warning, its only redeeming qualities would be fairy typing and its speed+encore (and freeze dry). None of these would warrant use in Ou by themselves. Ninetales only niche is as an Aurora veil setter, albeit one it fills exceptionally well.

 

[Jojobobo]

Third time in this post, but once again I'm sorry for coming across as rude/unpleasant. It wasn't my immediate intention, and in hindsight some of the comments were a little harsh/badly worded; I apologise.

No problem, thanks for apologising as it means more meaningful discussion can take place. I appreciate your points, I'll address a couple of them and then put this convo to bed, as others have mentioned mentioned this is a Ninetales thread and it's annoying people for it to be derailed.

Why are you trying to set on Mega Metagross in the first place lol? Same goes for all of these things that counter Ninetales lol. Also no you didn't say that; I can literally quote your original post (i.e. the one I was commenting on; I didn't read the other guy's response or your response to him, so if you said something different in that then that'd explain it): you say it's tricky, with tricky being a synonym of hard/difficult/etc..

In all fairness, I said a little tricky. I think this is more a semantics point, and more to do with the way British people speak (adding determiners before adjectives to dilute their emphasis). Not trivial is a better description.

Aside from Lele there are basically no common scarfers that are slower than Slash, rendering this point moot for the most part.

I mean the scarfed takes out Ninetales, and then Slash picks up the slack.

I was using the listed moves, which lack Rock Slide; that said, saccing EQ sounds really iffy because without EQ you are walled by all Steel-types in a meta where Steel-types are fucking everywhere, making it inefficient.

I said the original set was subject to change, not an ideal set necessarily, I was hoping for a bit of discussion about it rather than people losing their minds over it but other people (not you) don't seem keen. I think the Steel weakness should ideally be covered in the bulky sweepers in the first instance.

I'm not sure if I'm understanding part of this correctly due to ur browser bugging or smth idk, but if I am understanding "as I mentiuest User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Moption to set itself."

Yeah the forum bugged out, it happens a lot on longer posts I've found.

I think a lot of where people are misunderstanding me here is that how a lot of people play ArV Offense (I think ArV is a better abbreviation, given AV is already taken by Assault Vest) as bulky offense - where a bulkier rapid spinner or defogger with better typing is certainly better. I'm playing it as dual screens have always been played, as hyper offense with bulk. As such I'm not looking to make an entirely balanced team where I can check the stuff that gives Ninetales trouble with a lot of clever switches, I'm looking to set Aurora Veil at all costs and then bring my sweeper in. A secondary ArV setter helps with this dramatically as well as increasing the opportunities when I can set (against Steel types, etc.), and means I don't have to assemble a more defensively balanced team and rather can focus on bulky setup sweepers that have offensive synergy.

People have said for the purpose of secondary setting, "Aren't just regular dual screens better?" IMO, they are not. Take a Mew set with both Aurora Veil and Hail itself. Let's say (perhaps generously) 75% of the time when you bring that Mew in (because as mentioned opposing weather can have difficulty vs Hail) you can set Aurora Veil, 25% of the time you might have to set Hail yourself and then set Aurora Veil. That latter case takes both two move slots just like Reflect and Light Screen and two turns like Reflect and Light Screen, however 75% of the time you're getting it set in just one turn so the momentum is much better, and you have your Defog utility and Stealth Rock or U-turn pivoting to greatly assist the team in general and getting to a bulky sweeper.

While A-Slash with Aurora Veil may not be the best partner for A-Ninetales (mainly and only because of the shared fire weakness and how much trouble these teams have with Zard-Y to begin with in terms of setting up), there seems to be an unnecessary amount of rage and scorn about the set, which I genuinely think is workable and seems that way from testing. I think, as I said, this is because I think playing like HO is better than playing as BO for ArV (and I think a lot of you are trying the latter) - and so I don't expect my utility mons to have the same bulk, typing or recovery as a standard balance or BO utility mon. Rather I'm looking for them to most effectively assist with the utility I most strongly desire (the secondary ArV set in situations where the first can't set, which are numerous, and assists me in playing HO) and to provide an extra layer of utility on top of that (in this case, Rapid Spinning or Defogging). In this way, they are more effective and appropriate than the standard Rapid Spinners and Defoggers on the tier for the purposes of the play-style, and I don't have to prepare for mons like steel types in the same way for setting ArV as many other people do (I don't have to pack a counter, I can just set my ArV by a different means instead, so I'm more open to use the offensive options that I want to use).

However, people don't seem to agree with this play-style choice, so there's no real reason to further discuss it. If people want to make a BO or more balanced team of ArV then there's nothing wrong with that, but in a lot of ways I think the HO style I'm suggesting and facilitating with a secondary ArV setter is an easier means to build a team around (not that it makes for a better team necessarily, just that there's less to think about).

When is a Rapid Spin user has no reliable Recovery and a mediocre match up against most Stealth rock users ever a good idea? Doubly so when the typing is garbage even OUTSIDE the rocks? And the point being made is that the entire appeal of Aurora Veil is getting both screens in ONE action. Sandslash adds an additional action to the chain, because rather than Ninetales -> Aurora, the sequence becomes Ninetales -> Sandslash -> Aurora Veil.

The reasoning you provide is that Slash can be a back up setter, but Ninetales isn't a mon that has nearly as hard a time setting Veil a second time, because it's natural speed is actually good and it sets its own Hail. Sandslash needs Ninetales to have been on the field recently enough for hail to be present, and then has to make it onto the field with enough threat to force out the thing it's veiling on. Whether or not Ninetales is "easy" or "hard" to set the Veil with, Sandslash is objectively more difficult and inefficient to do so, in particular because the stacking weaknesses mean that most of Ninetales' answers will probably deal with him about as well. Given how Aurora Veil works, if you get it set once, you should have a sweeper able to break so much of the opponent's team that they can't keep momentum away from a Ninetales re-entry after their team's half dead. His coverage is garbage, he gets Walled by Bulky Waters like Tapu Fini (who proceeds to remove your screens and your Rocks along with theirs), or Manaphy who proceeds to set up Tail Glow/Z-Rain Dance (or BOTH given this thing) in your face and then murders your team. It also can't hit non-grounded Steels like Celesteela, who Automotizes in your face, or throws out some Leech Seeds to stall out your Hail, Magearna can Shift Gear on you to reach Speed tie with Max/Max (outspeeds this variant here even in Hail) and Aura Sphere/Fleur Cannon through your bulky attackers. Sandslash also becomes set up fodder for BU Buzzwole, and Defensive Mega Venusaur can stall out with Synthesis EVEN UNDER HAIL, or just kill you

252 Atk Sandslash-Alola Icicle Crash vs. 248 HP / 96+ Def Thick Fat Venusaur-Mega: 84-98 (23.1 - 26.9%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after hail damage
0 SpA Venusaur-Mega Hidden Power Fire vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Sandslash-Alola through Light Screen: 146-174 (50.1 - 59.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

This thing's damage is too pathetic to create chances for it to veil or to rapid spin hazards away, Ninetales gets away with it because it takes minimum conditional building, its speed tier is fast enough unaided to set up, Freeze Dry stops it from being totally passive shit against Tapu Fini or Pelipper, who are the best at removing/preventing its screens, and while not good, its typing still affords it a resistance or two that let it get the set up turn it needs for the Veil. Also, Encore is important for Ninetales because it doesn't have the power to break things, so it discourages setting up on it while it sets the Veil.

The entire appeal of Aurora Veil, as I said, is the speed of getting the two screens up so that a sweeper can get in and rampage. Suicide setters in previous gens were popular because they were an easy way to get them up early game once. Ninetales gets them up in fewer turns, and creates momentum almost as well by threatening Encore. Sandslash's set has you trying to give it more utility alongside Aurora Veil, when what a mon needs is options that FACILITATE Aurora Veil. That move is powerful enough to make an otherwise shit mon viable in Ninetales, and that's only because it has Snow Warning to completely ignore the obvious inhibition of the move. When you reach the point of needing another Aurora Veil setter, when the entire appeal is one mon being able to set both screens with it reliably, on its own, for others to sweep, then you're either not playing Aurora Veil well or against a team where you'll only fare worse for using Alolan Sandslash in any manner.

Alolan Sandslash is garbage in OU. Hell, Alolan Ninetales is garbage in OU for anything besides Aurora Veil, it just happens it's the one "good" user of a move that is very obviously stupid good. This discussion is maybe one step above the Merciless/Venoshock Toxapex I saw earlier.

You've covered pretty much all the same points as Martin, so this was pointless. There's really no need to address any of this as it has already all been responded to (and your comparisons are terrible and irrelevant, A-Slash would never try and get through a M-Venusaur, it would revenge weakened offensive sweepers), but kudos on the all caps typing at several points - it really added something to what you were trying to say.

Can we get back to discussing uses for Alolan Ninetales that prove relevant? What kind of sweepers do you think it pairs with well, offensive "blitzkreig" sweepers like DD M-Gyarados or Shift Gear Magearna, or bulky win conditions like BU Tapu Bulu/Buzzwole and Coil Zygarde? With the latter type, they're most at risk early when trying to accrue their boosts, so protection for those turns seems ideal, especially with Zygarde who can become nigh unkillable but lacks reliable recovery to support stacking multiple boosts until perhaps very late game.

I've made enough of a case of why I think a secondary setter is relevant, but yes let's get back to talking about sweepers and other offensive pairings.

I think Volcarona (Firium-Z, Quiver Dance/Fire Blast/HP Ground/Giga Drain) is pretty amazing under Aurora Veil, as you more or less double it's opportunities to set-up. Either you've kept rocks off your side (in which case the set-up opportunities are the same as normal), or you've got rocks on your side but set ArV (in which case again the set-up opportunities are the same as normal, as Volcarona loses half its health but now is doubly as bulky with Aurora Veil) or in the last case you have both rocks off and have set Aurora Veil in which case setting up is dramatically easier. With the amount of offensive pressure Volcarona packs, being able to set it without much trouble is a very powerful thing - I've even taken a Power Gem from a Diancie with it at the +1 SpDef under ArV.

I also think that Dugtrio can help a great deal. Though Sash Dugtrio may seem like an odd choice with the Hail recoil, it's handy to trap and kill TTar with reversal (who can often switch in easy enough a couple of times to Ninetales, as the SpDef boost from Sandstorm lets it tank a Moonblast) and also threatens to revenge Zard-Y. I'm still trying to figure out if this necessitates a whole team slot for trapping, but as it tackles these two big problems to ArV to an extent and if you retain the sash can check a boosting Volcarona, it seems like a worthwhile pick. I think Memento is a particularly worthy choice, as it means you can use Dugtrio as alternate means of bringing in a bulky sweeper or as an alternate means to more easily set ArV.

 

[Jojobobo]

Here's my Aurora Veil team that laddered to 1700 before the Dugtrio suspect for those interested: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/sm-ou-bazaar.3587317/page-16#post-7244988

PS It uses a secondary Aurora Veil setter ;p