1v1 - The Old Repository

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Team Building Guide for ladder



Ok, this is going to be a decently long one.


TL;DR

-Pick a Pokemon to build around

-Add mons that Synergize well with it.

-Test it. Use resources


In-depth Stuff

So Basically, you pick a pokemon. It can be any pokemon you want, but it's usually preferred to use a mon that's meta, like any pokemon from the S-B tiers on the viability rankings. Such a pokemon is your main win condition and is what you should mainly be using to pick the next two pokemon.


But First, let me go into the playstyles that are commonly found on ladder






Hyper Offense: Easiest style there is on the ladder. Typically a player will use hard hitting mons, like Porygon Z and Charizard, to get KO’s.


Stall: You’ve Faced it. Essentially, It's a playstyle designed not to lose by either reducing offensive capability, or just plain wearing your pokemon down.


CounterCoat: This Playstyle is based off you making the first move, then they counterattacking with either counter, metal burst, or magic coat. Occasionally carry taunt to not be setup fodder, and to force a attack.


Bulky Offense: Probably the most prevalent playstyle out there around now. They usually run pokemon bulky enough to take a hit, then attack back with a very powerful move. Its low risk most of the time, which is why it's used so often.

Gimmick: Sets based off a unique strategy, usually easy to beat when you know what it is




The two pokemon that you chose should support each other along with the pokemon that is built around, and your goal is to try to get to as close as you can get to a perfect team, in order to make skill and chance the only factors.

Usually around this point, you want to check all threats in the meta, which there are usually a lot of. Take for example Mega Mawile, which is very weak to Charizard. Adding a water type or a lure to Charizard, ie: Occa Berry Whimsicott. (As the opponent is likely to play a charizard against a team that it seemingly has a good time against) This will nullify your weakness, and the only thing you really need to worry about is prediction.


The last thing i want to say is that you should always test it, Go on ladder if you want. If you care about your rating too much, then you can always PM a person online if they want to battle for testing purposes.


That's all from me for now. A archetype guide will come shortly. For now, goodbye.


Good Resources:


https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/1v1-resources.3592842/


https://pokemonshowdown.com/damagecalc/


This will be edited shortly.
 
Shiinotic.png

Shiinotic UR -> D
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen71v1-763277848
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen71v1-763281244
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen71v1-763287861

At first I was using it for the memes, but this thing is actually half-decent. Probably good enough to go on D. Replays show basically what it does: Goes for bulk so it can tank enough hits to be able to set the opponent to sleep and then set up leech seeds and then either Strength Sap (if you're up against a physical opponent, which is where this thing mostly shines) or sets up Light Screen (if you're up against a special opponent, just so you're not entirely doomed). I feel like it sits pretty well with the likes of Aron or Clefable. Also, a tip: Dont give it Effect Spore. If it activates, you cant set your opponent to sleep.

And one more thing: Shiinotic might not be totally screwed if sleep is banned. Then it can run stuff like Effect Spore, and either way it might usually have to take a hit. Since, due to this things awful speed, its going to need to be able to tank a hit. But thats all it needs to take before it can be well on its way to a probable victory.

One last thing: I'm still trying it out, but in theory, Venusaur is gonna totally hurt it. Spore-immune poison type special/mixed attacker? No thanks.

edit: oh, yeah, and dont get me started on critical hits, but that's for any attack-lowering/defense-raising mon.

other edit: dont even mention any of the other mons with strength sap btw. none of them actually have spore besides shiinotic.
 
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Morgan

Morgius Sweep
is a Pre-Contributor
It is finally happening. I am going to nominate Kyurem for VR (I felt no external pressure to do this)
Kyurem: Unranked ->B/B+
As you can tell, I am a fan of this pokemon.
With the 224/136+/148 Bulk Spread it takes out all Zygardes, Defensive Magearna, Jumpluff, Primarina, Fini, Scarf or slow Specs/NormZ Porygon Z, non Rest Slowbro Mega, Altaria Mega, Blastoise Mega, Jumpluff, Landorus (Both), Ferrothorn, Celesteela, Magnezones not carrying Steelium Z, Sabeleye Mega, Aegislash, Golem, Donphan, Necrozma (Besides Fast Specs), Meloetta without Laser Focus, Heatran (Under 226 Speed), Kartana, Salazzle, Greninja, Aggron (Normal/Mega), Pinsir Mega, Rhyperior, Skarmory, Bulu, Victini, Curse Scizor Mega, *Dodrio*, and
Heracross-Mega(Under 226).

It can fare well against Mega Venusaur, Togekiss, Excadrill, and Volcarona

It also beats most things that are not part of the "meta" via PP Stalling Or A straight KO with Ice Beam or Earth Power

And That's just the guaranteed victories With Either Normalium Z, Icium Z, Or Groundium Z

Each Item has a couple of guaranteed victories that are unique to the primary list

Normalium Z In addition Beats Non Taunt Gyarados, Darmanitan, Has a very good matchup against Mawile Mega, and 50/50s Scarf Excadrill (Normalium Z Is The Best Set by Far!)

Groundium Z In addition beats Mawile, Excadrill and Darmanitan (Groundium Z is the Worst Set)

Icium Z In Addition Beats Dragonite (Icium Z is fine)

However, As many of you know, Kyurem has weaknesses, but not too many

Its Losses come from Blaziken, Lucario, Mimikyu, Gardevoir, Gallade, Diancie Mega, Taunt Gyarados (with Outrage) The Charizards, Metagross, FEAR, and Toxic Stall Pokemon Like Chansey and Pyukumuku

It also loses to PP Stall Deoxys Speed, Sub CM Raikou and Sub CM Suicune

And Loses to crits (Sometimes)

168 SpA Tapu Fini Moonblast vs. 224 HP / 148 SpD Kyurem on a critical hit: 326-386 (72.9 - 86.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

16 SpA Primarina Moonblast vs. 224 HP / 148 SpD Kyurem on a critical hit: 356-422 (79.6 - 94.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Good Job Ruining Someone's day by living their crit!

You see, It is imperative that you be the biggest coward possible at all times by spamming roost like the chicken that Kyurem is, but make sure to weave a noble roar or two in there

Kyurem is apparently as intimidating as Dialga, Palkia, and Giratina, being the only member of the KyuTrio to receive the Ability Pressure!

Pressure is the only reason this thing is good TBH, I mean if it didn't waste 2 PP every turn it'd be garbage. It also helps that noble roar is in the 3rd Highest PP Tier, 48, which if wasn't apparent, pretty high.

However, despite these pronounced weaknesses, I still believe that Kyurem would be a solid choice for either B or B+ tier, due to its good matchups against High Tiers and its ability to demolish the majority of the unranked pokemon.

Another Point towards Kyurem's Viability is that Elo Bandit Can't make a team to beat it for his life ROF

The Sets Can Be Found Here:

Normalium:

Kyurem @ Normalium Z
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 224 HP / 136 Def / 148 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Noble Roar
- Roost
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power

Icium:

Kyurem @ Icium Z
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 224 HP / 136 Def / 148 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Noble Roar
- Roost
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power

Groundium:

Kyurem @ Groundium Z
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 224 HP / 136 Def / 148 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Noble Roar
- Roost
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power[/QUOTE]


Upon doing some more calculations, I have determined that Kyurem Beats 61-67% of mons Ranked B+ and Above, and Beats 62-64% of the Entire VR!

If I was to describe Kyurem, I would call it Anti-Anti Meta

It beats most of the sturdy mons that tank massive hits from the Zards and Metagross

It beats a good number of scarfs that would be used to snipe your Lopunny or Greninja

It beats a good number of Dragons Because They just don't do enough damage and 296 SpA unboosted feels a bit excessive. I mean honestly, it has 9 less special attack than 252 SpA Timid Greninja.

It beats basically everything that boosts attack/special attack by one stage b/c of noble roar

Thanks for your time,
R1dd1m


EDIT: It seems as though I was wrong. Groundium is by far the best set of them all, because it can OHKO Offensive Metagross, Diancie (In Either Form), and As previously Mentioned, cleans up Excadrill and Mawile

Suprise OHKOing its main counters can be nice, and its only giving away Dragonite and A chance against gyarados
 
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Short post.

I don't agree with the Shiinotic thing. I've used it multiple times in the past, but it's definitely outclassed by Jumpluff/Whimsicott.

Definitely agree with kyurem. that shit op
 
Short post.

I don't agree with the Shiinotic thing. I've used it multiple times in the past, but it's definitely outclassed by Jumpluff/Whimsicott.

Definitely agree with kyurem. that shit op
Did you read my full post? Jumpluff doesnt get spore, and Whimsi doesnt even get strength sap. (dont know if whimsi has spore, too lazy to check.)

edit: Whimsi, indeed, has no spore.
 
View attachment 121633 Mega Gyarados-

Now that Tapu Koko is banned, I think Mega-Gyarados should either drop from S or Mega-Charizard-X should rise up to S.

How could banning Mega-Gyarados’s best counter make it worse? Well, it’s not worse, it’s just that everything else has become better now that Tapu Koko isn’t stifling other less broken mons. When Tapu Koko and Kyurem were in the meta, things were centered around a certain few Pokémon that Gyarados could beat, like Kyurem-Black, Charizard-X and Donphan. To put it another way, aside from Tapu Koko, Gyarados could beat all the strongest Pokémon. Now the weaker Pokémon that beat Gyarados have become more viable isn’t the absence of the formerly OP Tapu Koko. It has become less punishing to run Pokémon like Tapu Fini, Tapu Bulu, Celesteela, and even Breloom because they are no longer as bad relative to the overall power level of the meta.

View attachment 121634- Charizard

The Charizards should be two different Pokémon again and Charizard-Mega-X should rise to S. If Charizard is combined into one Pokémon it should pretty much always be S.

Charizard-Mega-X is better than Y because it is physical, can boost its attacking stat and can change its type. Dragon is also a very slightly better typing than Flying, so X gets to create a 50/50 without paying a price for it. Gyarados’s 50/50 isn’t as good, as Dark and Flying are equally good types. The 50/50 between Y and X is lost by Y more often than X, because rock coverage almost always beats Y, while X can win against weak coverage.

Perhaps this is just me justifying my feeling with bad reasoning. I’m not sure how to make this more understandable.
Not really adding anything new here, just wanted to post my oppinion of these noms.

Mega Gyarados S => A+

I have to dissagree here. I think Gyra is head and shoulders above everything else in A+ (exept for 'zard x, which I'll get to). While yes, the A+ 'mons are still amazing, I think that A+ is underselling how good this guy is.

Mega Charizard-X A+ => S

Now this I agree with this nom for a few reasons. First, I think x is the better 'zard, and should be in a different rank than y for all the reasons Kentari said. And secondly, I think that like Gyra, 'zard x is better than the other A+ 'mons.

Again, I know I added nothing new to this argument, I just wanted to voice my opinions.
 

pazza

Banned deucer.
Did you read my full post? Jumpluff doesnt get spore, and Whimsi doesnt even get strength sap. (dont know if whimsi has spore, too lazy to check.)
Yea well the thing is shiinictoic doesn't have the bulk and it has a bad typing imo

It is finally happening. I am going to nominate Kyurem for VR (I felt no external pressure to do this)
Kyurem: Unranked ->B/B+
As you can tell, I am a fan of this pokemon.
With the 224/136+/148 Bulk Spread it takes out all Zygardes, Defensive Magearna, Jumpluff, Primarina, Fini, Scarf or slow Specs/NormZ Porygon Z, non Rest Slowbro Mega, Altaria Mega, Blastoise Mega, Jumpluff, Landorus (Both), Ferrothorn, Celesteela, Magnezones not carrying Steelium Z, Sabeleye Mega, Aegislash, Golem, Donphan, Necrozma (Besides Fast Specs), Meloetta without Laser Focus, Heatran (Under 226 Speed), Kartana, Salazzle, Greninja, Aggron (Normal/Mega), Pinsir Mega, Rhyperior, Skarmory, Bulu, Victini, Curse Scizor Mega, *Dodrio*, and
Heracross-Mega(Under 226).

It can fare well against Mega Venusaur, Togekiss, Excadrill, and Volcarona

It also beats most things that are not part of the "meta" via PP Stalling Or A straight KO with Ice Beam or Earth Power

And That's just the guaranteed victories With Either Normalium Z, Icium Z, Or Groundium Z

Each Item has a couple of guaranteed victories that are unique to the primary list

Normalium Z In addition Beats Non Taunt Gyarados, Darmanitan, Has a very good matchup against Mawile Mega, and 50/50s Scarf Excadrill (Normalium Z Is The Best Set by Far!)

Groundium Z In addition beats Mawile, Excadrill and Darmanitan (Groundium Z is the Worst Set)

Icium Z In Addition Beats Dragonite (Icium Z is fine)

However, As many of you know, Kyurem has weaknesses, but not too many

Its Losses come from Blaziken, Lucario, Mimikyu, Gardevoir, Gallade, Diancie Mega, Taunt Gyarados (with Outrage) The Charizards, Metagross, FEAR, and Toxic Stall Pokemon Like Chansey and Pyukumuku

It also loses to PP Stall Deoxys Speed, Sub CM Raikou and Sub CM Suicune

And Loses to crits (Sometimes)

168 SpA Tapu Fini Moonblast vs. 224 HP / 148 SpD Kyurem on a critical hit: 326-386 (72.9 - 86.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

16 SpA Primarina Moonblast vs. 224 HP / 148 SpD Kyurem on a critical hit: 356-422 (79.6 - 94.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Good Job Ruining Someone's day by living their crit!

You see, It is imperative that you be the biggest coward possible at all times by spamming roost like the chicken that Kyurem is, but make sure to weave a noble roar or two in there

Kyurem is apparently as intimidating as Dialga, Palkia, and Giratina, being the only member of the KyuTrio to receive the Ability Pressure!

Pressure is the only reason this thing is good TBH, I mean if it didn't waste 2 PP every turn it'd be garbage. It also helps that noble roar is in the 3rd Highest PP Tier, 48, which if wasn't apparent, pretty high.

However, despite these pronounced weaknesses, I still believe that Kyurem would be a solid choice for either B or B+ tier, due to its good matchups against High Tiers and its ability to demolish the majority of the unranked pokemon.

Another Point towards Kyurem's Viability is that Elo Bandit Can't make a team to beat it for his life ROF

The Sets Can Be Found Here:

Normalium:

Kyurem @ Normalium Z
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 224 HP / 136 Def / 148 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Noble Roar
- Roost
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power

Icium:

Kyurem @ Icium Z
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 224 HP / 136 Def / 148 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Noble Roar
- Roost
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power

Groundium:

Kyurem @ Groundium Z
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 224 HP / 136 Def / 148 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Noble Roar
- Roost
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power

I think it should be B- because set up in 1v1 is not consistent unless it has an ability that makes it so it can't be critted. Because crit's will get you every time.
 

Tol

Retirement house
My thoughts on these recent posts:
Shiinotic is frankly outclassed as a sleeper by literally everything else, as a strength sapper by Jumpluff and even Vileplume, basically this post is “I’ve won a few games with this bad mon, therefore it deserves a spot on the VR.” This isn’t really a good way to go about doing things. Assault Vest Scrafty has more of a niche than Shiinotic does.
On kyurem, it definitely deserves a spot, as it is probably the best PP staller after deo-d. Deo-S can pull it off, however kyurem dies to less crits and has a degree of offensive pressure. Maybe B or B minus would suit it well.
Pinsir post possibly coming soon to a VR thread near you
 
To all the people about Shiinotic: Spore is an 100% accuracy sleep move. With the other ones you people have mentioned, what do you do if sleep powder or whatever misses, hmm? What do you do then? And also, all Shiinotic really needs to take is one hit. If its not OHKO'd, it can usually do pretty well.
 

pqs

Banned deucer.
Okay i'll make this post short and simple:
Aggron-Mega B+ --> B
This really doesn't have to do with the Tapu Koko ban or anything but right now I think the other B+ mons are doing alot better in the metagame than Aggron-Mega. Donphan, Altaria-Mega, Greninja, and others all seem to be doing better. Maybe instead of Aggron-Mega dropping, some other mons raising?

Edit: I'll maybe make some more noms rn i'm just scrolling down the VR and noticed this
 
To all the people about Shiinotic: Spore is an 100% accuracy sleep move. With the other ones you people have mentioned, what do you do if sleep powder or whatever misses, hmm? What do you do then? And also, all Shiinotic really needs to take is one hit. If its not OHKO'd, it can usually do pretty well.
I'd take a 75% chance to actually accomplish something over a guaranteed failure; Shiinotic is too slow, and too frail to make up for that fact. Every pokemon in the metagame outspeeds it, essentially, so unlike jumpluff who can click sleep before they attack it has to rely on living a hit, which it just can't often do.

If you want a bulky sleep using grass type, try mega venusaur; if you want a bulky sleep user with 100% accuracy, try snorlax.
 
Squidy822 i have read the entire post. Shiinotic is heavily outclassed by Whimsicott and Jumpluff, even with spore. Strength Sap doesnt help against special attackers. Slow spore doesnt help against super effective attacks. Jumpluff has a fast sleep powder, beating anything thats slower than it, and only 17% of the time will a wide lens powder miss, which is negligible. whimsicott has prankster, allowing it to win if it can tank one hit from a pokemon via babiri/occa berry. I have probably used shiinotic for longer than you have played 1v1, tbh. Just letting you know, as QT said, its completely outclassed by pretty much every other sleep user.

plus you're really low ladder, so you can win with anyhting
 
To all the people about Shiinotic: Spore is an 100% accuracy sleep move. With the other ones you people have mentioned, what do you do if sleep powder or whatever misses, hmm? What do you do then? And also, all Shiinotic really needs to take is one hit. If its not OHKO'd, it can usually do pretty well.
Well, with the dominance of the Zards and all, Shiinotic cant really take hits. Especially Zard Y, who ignores Strength Sap and OHKOs with Blast Burn. Even Zard X OHKOs with Flare Blitz. And, as said by Quantum Tesseract , If you want bulky grass sleeper use Venu-M; if you want a bulky 100% accurate sleeper, try YawnLax.
Although I actually want sleep banned
 

Morgan

Morgius Sweep
is a Pre-Contributor
Also, quick question, why is Heracross-M ranked at B? Sure it’s strong but it’s pretty slow.
Heracross Should be Ranked At B due to it being able to decimate toxic stallers by neglecting to Mega, and OHKOing things like even defensive Kyurem (4+ Atk Heracross-Mega Close Combat vs. 224 HP / 136+ Def Kyurem: 420-494 (93.9 - 110.5%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO) that it outspeeds by 1 point with 164 speed, and even if Kyurem lives, it can't return the kill, even with Icium, 0 SpA Kyurem Subzero Slammer (175 BP) vs. -1 208 HP / 132 SpD Heracross-Mega: 298-352 (84.4 - 99.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

It also lives Through Meloetta Z Hyper Beam and cleanly returns the favor with pin missle

It can beat Gyarados With Either Rock Blast, Pin Missle, or Bullet Seed, and ABSOLUTELY DEVOURS a +1 Adamant Mega Waterfall
- +1 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Gyarados-Mega Waterfall vs. 208 HP / 0 Def Heracross-Mega: 219-258 (62 - 73%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Gyarados Can't Even 2KO
- 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Gyarados-Mega Waterfall vs. 208 HP / 0 Def Heracross-Mega: 145-172 (41 - 48.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Heracross On the Other Hand cleans Up with Bullet Seed into Pin Missle If Mega or into Rock Blast if not Mega

It also has a great matchup into Metagross if it isn't isn't carrying Zen Headbutt, which only 34.6% of them do
 
Mega Heracross is actually pretty good. Sure, it gets destroyed by the 'Zards and M-meta, but it has nice bulk, and beats things like Meloetta, and Gyra, like AllFourtyOne said.

Now for some of the other noms.

Shiinotic UR -> D

I have to disagree here. Like many others said before me, this guy is really slow, and isn't nearly bulky enough to live hits from things like the 'zards, and anything with poison moves. Also, while strength sap is nice, special attackers don't care about the attack drop. Spore is nice, but when things like Snorlax and venu are bulky enough to withstand hits and put the opponent to sleep, and things like jumpluff outspend most of the metagame, I just don't see this guy have even the smallest of nitches.


Kyurem UR ->B/B+

I agree with this being ranked, as the Noble Roar set enables it to beat a bunch of threats. However, I think B+, even B is way to high for this thing. Why? Because of one mon, which is all over the ladder: Metagross. Since most Kyurems do run the Noble Roar set, 'gross souldn't mega , since it should have clear body in pre-mega form , and then all it needs to do is spam Meteor Mash and Bullet Punch until Kyurem is dead. Yes, I know, it's 1 'mon, but that 1 'mon is crazy common rn, and it eats the dragon for lunch, so I think B- is fine for it.

Expect a nomination of a certain dragon soon.
 

Morgan

Morgius Sweep
is a Pre-Contributor
Mega Heracross is actually pretty good. Sure, it gets destroyed by the 'Zards and M-meta, but it has nice bulk, and beats things like Meloetta, and Gyra, like AllFourtyOne said.

Now for some of the other noms.

Shiinotic UR -> D

I have to disagree here. Like many others said before me, this guy is really slow, and isn't nearly bulky enough to live hits from things like the 'zards, and anything with poison moves. Also, while strength sap is nice, special attackers don't care about the attack drop. Spore is nice, but when things like Snorlax and venu are bulky enough to withstand hits and put the opponent to sleep, and things like jumpluff outspend most of the metagame, I just don't see this guy have even the smallest of nitches.


Kyurem UR ->B/B+

I agree with this being ranked, as the Noble Roar set enables it to beat a bunch of threats. However, I think B+, even B is way to high for this thing. Why? Because of one mon, which is all over the ladder: Metagross. Since most Kyurems do run the Noble Roar set, 'gross souldn't mega , since it should have clear body in pre-mega form , and then all it needs to do is spam Meteor Mash and Bullet Punch until Kyurem is dead. Yes, I know, it's 1 'mon, but that 1 'mon is crazy common rn, and it eats the dragon for lunch, so I think B- is fine for it.

Expect a nomination of a certain dragon soon.
BuT SuPeRsTrIkE Fast Metagross Dies to Groundium Z Kyurem, which can be a very {unfun} surprise to any cocky Metagross User and if you neglect to mega, its totally over, Because it needs 252 HP and 104 SpDef to have a 100% chance to survive the TecRage.
 

Morgan

Morgius Sweep
is a Pre-Contributor
Theheheheh asked me to make a "Kyurem vs the VR" matchup chart. So I did, and you can find it here
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fZKD3bqVmvX_d9Vzrn8mWVRoZ24usS5oJdNZmqTxE-w/edit?usp=sharing

Its been organized by tier, and I go over what Kyurem sets beat what mons if they are different.

One thing that tends to be annoying when I watch other people use Kyurem is that they don't fully understand how to win the matchups, so I'm going to describe how to win every single matchup you can.

Gyarados: Z Noble Roar -> Noble Roar Spam /// If Taunt: Ice Beam Spam
Dragonite: Subzero Slammer
Magearna: Noble Roar Spam
Metagross: Tectonic Rage
Landorus T: Ice Beam/Subzero Slammer
CurseLax: Spam Noble Roar
Zygod: Either Noble Roar or Ice Beam
Zone: Ice Beam -> Earth Power (To Dodge around Mirror Coat)
PZ: Spam Noble Roar
Slowbro: Burn Ice Beams early, Spam Noble Roar
Venusaur: Spam Noble Roar and Roost, Hope they don't have sludge bomb
Aegislash: Noble Roar Spam into TecRage/EP
Altaria: SubZero/Ice Beam Twice
Aggron: Noble Roar Spam, Ice Beam to Dodge Around Metal Burst, Clean Up with EP/TecRage
Golphan: Noble Roar a few times, Roost, EP->Ice Beam
Greninja: Press Noble Roar Twice, Roost once, they concede most of the time
Pluff: Roost When Under 70 for wake, try to hit ice beams/SubZeros early
Naga: Press IceBeam/SubZero/TecRage, hope for the best
Melo: Spam Noble Roar, Hope they already NormZ'd before LF
Pinsir: Press Ice Beam/SubZero
Fini: Spam Noble Roar, Stay Above 86%
Primarina: See Fini, Stay At Max Health
Chansey: Spam Your Moves, PP stall
Ferrothorn: Spam Noble Roar, Fish For EP Drops, Offensive Z or Ice Beam
Garchomp: Ice Beam/SZS
Heatran: Ice Beam -> EP/TecRage if Balloon, EP/TecRage if no Balloon
Heracross: If You are 8 Speed Normalium, Z Noble, Roost, Noble, Alternate
Kartana: Ice Move
Mawile: NormZ- Z Noble, Noble, Roost, Noble, Roost, Earth Power, Roost, Earth Power if no Swords, EP immediately after they swords GroundZ- TecRage turn 1
Necrozma: Spam Noble Roar
Sableye: Ice Moves
TTar Mega: ZNoble or Noble Spam, Roost, TecRage/EP 2-3 times
Blastoise Mega: Noble Roar Spam
Blissey: See Chansey
Buzzwole: Noble Roar Spam
Celesteela: Noble Roar Spam (PP Stall)
Diancie: Tectonic Rage
Hoopa-Unbound: Noble Roar Spam (Stall out of Choiced Move)
Kommo-o: Subzero Slammer
Deoxys Speed (Non Stall): Noble Roar, Roost, Attack
Drill: ZNoble Roost Attack or Offense Z
Latios: Z Noble or Subzero Slammer
Marowak: Noble Roar Spam, TecRage if groundium
Porygon2: PP Stall
Scizor: Noble Roar Spam
Victini: Noble Roar -> Roost -> Earth Power, Repeat if necessary
Blah: Earth Power
Mega Garchomp: Ice Move
Haxorus: Ice Move
Hydreigon: Ice Move
Infernape: Noble Roar Spam
Keldeo: Noble Roar Spam
Landorus I: Ice Move
Latias: Noble Roar Spam
Meowstic Male: Whatever you want
Nihilego: TecRage
Pidgeot: This is free time
Relicanth: Noble Roar
ThundyT: Ice moves
Cloyster: Noble Roar -> Ground Move
Rhyperior: Noble Roar Spam
Serperior: Ice Moves *DO NOT NOBLE ROAR*
Salazzle: Ground Move
Skarmory: Z Noble-> Ice beam, Ice Beam
Abamasnow: Do whatever
Alakazam: If Focus Blast, Hope For miss
Azumarill: Noble Roar
Barbaracle: Noble Roar, Ground Move
Clefable: Ice Moves and Roost (Or TecRage)
Manectric: Noble Roar
Sceptile: Ice Move
Slaking: Noble Roar Spam
Stunfisk: Noble Roar Spam
Type Null: PP Stall
Volcanion: Noble Roar a few times, Ground Moves
Ditto: PP Stall (Its only 17 turns)


Thank You for Your Time,

R1dd1m
 
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sry this on my brothers account but can we make a whole list of threats cuz I wanna try this kyu thing or is there already a threat list and I'm just blind (it's James155 btw on my brothers account)
 
Hi, it’s TSC here (that one guy who nominated Scolipede but where no one reacted to) with some nominations.

Nidoking Unranked --> C- / C
Nidoking stands out when it comes to movespread. It has access to great moves of almost every type. It has Ice Beam to counter its ground type weaknesses like Landorus-therian and Zygarde and STAB moves like Poison Jab, Sludge Wave, Earthquake and Earth Power. Together with its ability Sheer Force these moves get more power overall. Because of its unique typing it is able to beat almost every fairy type like Mega Altaria, Mega Mawile, Magearna and Togekiss (but needs Choice Specs to beat Primarina, Tapu Fini and Tapu Lele). It can easily be used to counter specific threats because of his movespread. It can either be used as Special Attacker or Physical Attacker or Mixed.

Viable Items:
  • Choice Scarf
  • Choice Specs / Choice Band
  • Life Orb (Sheer Force)
  • Shuca Berry / Air Balloon
  • Poisonium Z / Groundium Z
A list of useful moves it can learn of each type:
Poison: Poison Jab, Sludge Bomb, Sludge Wave
Ground: Earthquake, Earth Power, Bulldoze
Fire: Fire Blast, Flamethrower, Fire Punch
Water: Aqua Tail, Surf
Electric: Thunder, Thunderbolt
Normal: Double Edge, Return, Frustation, Giga Impact, Chip Away, Body Slam (wouldn’t recommend this)
Fighting: Focus Blast, Superpower
Ice: Ice Beam, Blizzard, Ice Punch, Icy Wind, Avalanche
Dragon: Outrage, Dragon Pulse
Rock: Rock Slide, Rock Tomb, Head Smash, Stone Edge
Bug: Megahorn
Ghost: Shadow Ball, Shadow Claw
Dark: Sucker Punch, Throat Chop


Sets:
Choice Specs
Nidoking @ Choice Specs
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 236 SpA / 20 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Sludge Wave
- Earth Power
- Fire Blast

Choice Scarf:
Nidoking @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Earth Power
- Focus Blast / Sludge Wave
- Head Smash
- Ice Beam

Shuca Berry:
Nidoking @ Shuca Berry
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 HP / 188 Def / 68 SpA
Bold Nature
- Sludge Wave
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Fire Blast / Smack Down


While this nomination seems pretty obvious, I haven’t seen anyone came up with it. My second nomination however, might be unexpected. I honestly didn’t know how this thing could take on a big part of the VR until I used it myself.

Cofagrigus unranked --> D / C-
We can all agree that an ability that causes the opponent’s ability to change by a single touch is good. Cofagrigus makes this real. Its bulk of 58/145/105 is fantastic because it makes it able for Cofagrigus to tank powerful moves like Flyinium Z Landorus-Therian without adding any defence. Its Ghost typing together with its ability Mummy makes it able to beat Mega-Lopunny (even with Scrappy) and Yawn Snorlax with Will-O-Wisp stall. Mummy also takes away abilities like Tough Claws from Mega Metagross, Huge power from Mega Mawile and Azumarill, Pure Power from Mega Medicham, Pixilate/Aerilate from physical Mega Altaria and Mega Pinsir and Technician from Mega Scizor.

Set:
Cofagrigus @ Wiki Berry
Ability: Mummy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split
- Hex


About the Shiinotic and Kyurem nominations:

I disagree with Shiinotic because I don’t see it bulk any attacks from A and B rank mons in the meta and it is too slow to counter. (I like to see these obscure nominations like I do :) )

I agree Kyurem because since the Kyurem-Black ban I always wanted to build around Kyurem and I saw it’s amazing stall of the 1v1 legend Osra.

Furthermore I disagree with some other D rank mon.

Barbaracle D rank --> unranked
Barbaracle was ranked because of its niche with Shell Smash + Tough Claws, but I have to admit that because of its low speed of 68, that it will be countered with a Z-Move easily before it can even set up a Shell Smash. It doesn’t really beat a lot of mons in the S, A and B rank. I just think Barbaracle gets outclassed by Crustle and Carracosta and that’s why I never see it in the ladder. So it doesn’t deserve to be ranked in my opinion.

I want to know everyone’s opinion on these to improve my writing. It would help me out a lot. Thanks already.
 

Nalei

strong, wild garbage
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Nidoking Unranked --> C- / C
Yeah Nidoking could get ranked ig. The only item that I see it having a distinct niche with is Specs, though. D imo
Cofagrigus unranked --> D / C-
I don't really see this mon as being viable. It can lose to so many mons that it'd like to beat if they just simply Substitute to dodge the WoW.
About the Shiinotic and Kyurem nominations:
Shiinotic is an absolute no. Kyurem could get C+ I think.
Barbaracle D rank --> unranked
NO
...please? Okay, I'll justify its ranking. So imo, a Pokemon has a niche so long as it has a set of mons it beats that no other Pokemon can beat. I'll make a list of what Barbaracle can beat and see if I can find anything that directly outclasses it. Here's the set:
Barbara <3 (Barbaracle) @ Rockium Z
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 92 HP / 208 Atk / 20 Def / 184 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shell Smash
- Stone Edge
- Superpower
- Taunt / Rock Tomb / Liquidation
Mega Gyarados, Mega Charizard X, Mimikyu (Rock Tomb, unreliable), Snorlax (Taunt), Porygon-Z, Jumpluff (Taunt), Meloetta (unreliable), Mega Pinsir, Chansey (Taunt), Heatran, Mega Tyranitar, Blissey, Crustle (Taunt, unreliable), Mega Diancie, Togekiss, Whimsicott (Taunt), Mega Camerupt (Liquidation), Carracosta (Taunt, unreliable), Alolan Marowak, Porygon2, Victini, Vivillon (Taunt), Entei, Haxorus (Scarf), Mega Latias (Taunt), Meowstic (Taunt), Mega Pidgeot, Relicanth (Taunt, unreliable), Cloyster, Pyukumuku (Taunt), Rhyperior (Liquidation), Mega Abomasnow, Clefable (Taunt), Dusclops (Taunt), Type: Null (Taunt), Volcanion

Some people have argued that Crustle, Carracosta and Relicanth are better than Barbaracle, but it can beat many Pokemon that none of them can beat like Mega Gyarados (with any level of reliability), Mimikyu, TTar, Whimsicott and Pyukumuku. I went through the top of the tier list and couldn't find anything that could replicate Barbaracle's niche. Let me know if you find anything that outclasses Barbaracle.

Some misc noms:

Mega Gyarados is no better than Charizard or Mimikyu at this point. Mega Charizard and Mimikyu to S is one option, but Mimikyu to S, separating the Zards and dropping Dnite to A would also be okay. Abolishing the S rank altogether and dropping Dnite could also work.

Zeraora should be B+ or A- I think. Here's some sets for the purpose of discussion:
Zeraora @ Life Orb
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 124 Atk / 192 SpA / 192 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Fake Out
- Grass Knot
- Plasma Fists
- Hidden Power [Ice] / Close Combat

Zeraora @ Electrium Z
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 184 Atk / 132 Def / 192 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Bulk Up
- Plasma Fists
- Fake Out / Substitute / Taunt
- Charge / Substitute / Taunt


Buzzwole B- to C
Buzzwole just isn't good. Its defensive typing is nearly as bad as its SpD stat.

Mega Camerupt C+ to C
Should have dropped after the Koko ban. It used to be cool in that it beat Kyub and Koko but can't do that anymore.

Mega Lucario C+ to C
Another mon that's just not good anymore. Trends like Flame Charge Zard and bulkier everything make it hard to win with this.
 
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