Z-Move Discussion

EDIT: i'll edit in answers as available. Credits to @ kalalokki ,
@ yetanotherperson

Bunch of Z moves related questions below that may or may not have been answered. I couldnt find answers in the OP (maybe i missed them) but anw:

Do Z moves carry over priority of base moves, from +1, +2 to +7 like Pursuit?

EDIT: no. Tested with Mach Punch

Z moves ignore negative stat drops of user but does it ignore stat boosts? Does it ignore stat drops/ stat boosts of foes?

Do Z moves from Draco Meteor and its clones cause the stat drop? Same for base moves that cause recharge (Pulverizing Pancake could be a special case?), recoil, stat gains, regain health, switching, phazing, flinching, trapping or FAINTING like Explosion?

EDIT: tested with Draco Meteor and it doesnt cause stat drops and other effects above seem to not happen as well

Are Z moves from Fly, Solar Beam and its friends 2-turn moves? If yes then which turn is the damage executed? And if the damage is executed on turn 1 then do you remain in the semi-invulnerable/ charging state? and do you do damage from the base move the next turn?

EDIT: one-turn move. You move freely after the Z move. Tested with Fly, Solar Beam

Can Eevee use Extremeevoboost anytime or does it need to be able to use Last Resort first? As in does it need to use all its other moves to unlock Last Resort to use the Z move? (Good bye Baton passing the boosts if this were the case)

EDIT: you dont need to be able to use Last Resort for the Z move (BP away!!!). Using the Z move doesnt allow you to use Last Resort without unlocking the normal way though.

If the base move runs of out PP, can it still be used to execute the Z move?

EDIT: no

If the base move is under the effect of Imprison, Disable or Torment, can it be used for the Z move?

How does Me First interact with Z move?

If Z move based on High Jump Kick and Jump Kick miss due to immunity, do you take recoil? How do these interact with moves like Protect? The damage is reduced to 25% but do you take recoil?

EDIT: you don't take recoil if miss due to immunity. Unsure about Protect but most likely no recoil either

Do Z moves benefit from damage boosting abiliities like Adaptability or Tinted Lens or Sheer Force or Stake Out?

Do Z moves get boosted by weather or terrain?

Do Z moves benefit from immunity ignoring abilities like Scrappy or Mold Breaker?

EDIT: yes, tested with Scrappy

Do Z moves get STAB?

Can Z moves be critical hits?

Would Z moves based on Sky Drop and clones fail if Sky Drop were to fail? Or other base moves with conditions to succeed like Dream Eater, SUCKER PUNCH, FAKE OUT?

EDIT: Z moves based on these work regardless of the success of base moves. For example, you can Z move Fake Out on your second turn out

Do Z moves trigger Storm Drain, Water Absorb, etc?

Do Desolate Land and Primordial Sea cancel Water and Fire Z moves?

Can Z move based on Sucker Punch fail? Can Z move trigger Sucker Punch?

Do Z moves make contact?

Do Z moves trigger secondary effect of Spiky Shield, King's Shield and Baneful Bunker?

Can parahax, confusion hax or attract hax waste your Z move?

Do Hyperspace Fury and Hyperpspace Hole, Shadow Force, Feint Z moves bypass Protect completely?

Do Z moves retain the sound, ball/ bullet, dance, etc property of the base moves to interact with appropriate abilities?

Do Z moves with base moves that have fang, punch, pulse properties get boosted by Strong Jaw, Iron Fist, Mega Launcher?

Z moves and Protean?

EDIT: yes. Change type before Z move
 
Last edited:
Did some tesing in-game by Heart Swapping +6 Evasion on a wild Pokemon and hitting w8th a Z-move. In 10-12 tries there wasn't a single miss. So, either I'm exceptionally lucky today or Z-moves ignore accuracy checks and always hit.

Also, Copycat can't be exploited to have multi-use Z-moves. Using Copycat directly right after the Z-move resulted in Copycat failing, even if other copiable moves had been made before the Z-move.
 
I don't know if any of you guys participate in CAP, but I just looked at what Z-parting shot did. Kerfluffle is broken. Heals replacement 100% ". DA FAQ
 

Dunfan

formerly Dunsparce Fanboy
The Z-move based on Tailwind will make Honchkrow very good.

Honchkrow @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Super Luck
EVs: 60 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Tailwind
- Superpower
- Sucker Punch
- Brave Bird

Super Luck + Critical hit boost make you always crit.
Crits ignore lowered stats, so you can use Superpower as much as you want.
The Flyinium Z can also be used with Brave Bird for a strong flying-type nuke.
And Sucker Punch is here to stop priority shenanigans.

Wow.
 

Katakiri

Listen, Brendan...
is a Researcher Alumnus
I thought of something while messing around with a Hail team: Offensive Z-Moves are about hitting something as hard as you can. Kyurem-B is about hitting something as hard as it can. So why not have your ice cream and your cake?

Kyurem-Black @ Icium Z
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Fusion Bolt
- Outrage / Iron Head / Substitute
- Freeze Shock [Subzero Slammer (200 BP)]


This is an alternative to CB Kyurem-B that can wipe-out it's usual switch-ins and possibly play around Misty Terrain if Tapu Fini becomes a thing. Slightly gimmicky considering Subzero Slammer is a one-time use and regular Freeze Shock is otherwise an empty move-slot without a Sub up but it's a nuke stronger than Choice Band Outrage with no immunities which is saying a whole lot.

252+ Atk Teravolt Kyurem-B Subzero Slammer (200 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 262-309 (179.4 - 211.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Teravolt Kyurem-B Subzero Slammer (200 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Excadrill: 343-405 (184.4 - 217.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Teravolt Kyurem-B Subzero Slammer (200 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Alolan Ninetales: 144-171 (96.6 - 114.7%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Teravolt Kyurem-B Subzero Slammer (200 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 201-237 (99.5 - 117.3%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Teravolt Kyurem-B Subzero Slammer (200 BP) vs. 252 HP / 88+ Def Ferrothorn: 154-183 (85 - 101.1%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Teravolt Kyurem-B Subzero Slammer (200 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Mega Sableye: 195-231 (124.2 - 147.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Teravolt Kyurem-B Subzero Slammer (200 BP) vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 211-250 (102.4 - 121.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Teravolt Kyurem-B Subzero Slammer (200 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 114-135 (64.4 - 76.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

If you just want to make your opponent lose a Pokemon to win the numbers game, for no set-up, Kyurem-B Subzero Slammer is probably the most bang you're gonna get for your Z-buck. It is criminally difficult to switch into without a Heatran or Mega Scizor. I don't think I've ever seen a time where standard defensive Ferrothorn was ever getting OHKO'd from a no setup, non-SE move. Wild.
 
Last edited:
Speaking of nuclear firepower (pun intended):


Victini @ Firium Z
Ability: Victory Star
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-Turn / Other coverage
- Will-o-Wisp (+1 Atk, then burns)
- Bolt Strike
- V-create (260 BP Inferno Overdrive)

Opponent doesn't have an immunity? Unleash your 1-click nuke.
Opponent sends their slow counter/resist? Get +1 Atk, burn them, then hit them with a +1 coverage move or U-Turn. Or you can also hit them with +1 V-create, if you predict a switch.

The Z-Crystals will create a lot of mind games.
 
Last edited:

CTNC

Doesn't know how to attack
http://i.4cdn.org/vp/1479074042241.webm

In addition to the +2 Attack, Z-Mirror Move also becomes the Z-Move of the type you copied.

For example, Pidgeot here gets +2 Attack, and since it copied Icy Wind, it uses the Ice-type Z-Move Subzero Slammer.
That sounds stupid. Let me check what gets it... Hmm... Do Status Z-Moves get Priority from Prankster? Let me check the research thread... Yes, this looks good. Before I get too excited, let me see if Mirror Move fails if the opponent switch out... it does, but you can still play mind games with your opponent. It's good enough for potential gimmicks.




Murkrow @ Birdium Z
Ability: Prankster
Nature: Niave (+Spe - SpD) or Naughty (+Atk -SpD)
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe?
- Sucker Punch
- Brave Bird/Drill Peck
- Substitute
- Mirror Move

This is a bizarre revenge killer variant. In the best case scenario, you're able to get Sword Dance and a Z-Move off of Z-Mirror Move. Substitute is there for the turn you come in in case the opponent switches. (which is likely if they know this idea) The reason for the remaining 4 EVs being put in Special Attack and the Minus Special Defense Nature is that you might get a Special Z-Move instead of a Physical one. This moveset is probably a gimmick, but it's still a fun idea. I might have to try this in the Battle Tree.
 
http://i.4cdn.org/vp/1479074042241.webm

In addition to the +2 Attack, Z-Mirror Move also becomes the Z-Move of the type you copied.

For example, Pidgeot here gets +2 Attack, and since it copied Icy Wind, it uses the Ice-type Z-Move Subzero Slammer.
Imagine Mirror Moving Z-Splash.

+5 Attack in one turn and no HP loss unlike Belly Drum.

Mirror Move suddenly got so much better. Not (pre-Super) Mystery Dungeon levels of broken, but actually good.

It's like Imposter giving you two Megas in your team if you switch into a Mega. Mirror Move gives you two Z-Moves per team.
 
Last edited:
Somebody more familiar with using Gyarados might be able to answer this pretty insignificant question I have:

Does Gyarados get any use competitively out of the flying Z-Move it would gain from Bounce? It'd be a one time shot, but currently it is its only access to a one-turn physical Flying STAB move.
 
Typhlosion could work with Firium Z and Sunny Day+Eruption, Z-Sunny Day boosts your stabs and gives you a nice +1 in Speed, if only this mon had a little more base speed, it gives you the ability to go for a nuke or set up.
 
Not sure if Anyone has tested this, but what goes the Ghost Z cyrstal do with Curse? Or does it not do anything this its a ??? move?
 
Not sure if Anyone has tested this, but what goes the Ghost Z cyrstal do with Curse? Or does it not do anything this its a ??? move?
Curse isnt a ??? move anymore since gen 4or5 it's now a ghost move... for the Z-move:
Z-Curse Restores user's HP 100% if user is Ghost-type, Attack ↑ otherwise (the health restoration is done before you pay life to use curse)
 
Curse isnt a ??? move anymore since gen 4or5 it's now a ghost move... for the Z-move:
Z-Curse Restores user's HP 100% if user is Ghost-type, Attack ↑ otherwise (the health restoration is done before you pay life to use curse)
Ah nice nice. That is so tempting to use on Decidueye, but I have an Alolan persian with the Dark Z cyrstal for Parting shot. If I didn't have Persian I would so do that, for easy to set up curses.
 

Cresselia~~

Junichi Masuda likes this!!
Somebody more familiar with using Gyarados might be able to answer this pretty insignificant question I have:

Does Gyarados get any use competitively out of the flying Z-Move it would gain from Bounce? It'd be a one time shot, but currently it is its only access to a one-turn physical Flying STAB move.
I suggest Normalium Z + splash, which +3 to attack.
 
How does Eevee's Extreme Evoboost work? It's not in the stickied thread.
This, but to be more specific, do we know if the move needs to actually work or can it fail and still work? For example, can Last Resort/Stored Power/Hp Fight/Baton Pass Eevee just use Last Resort to get to +2 All stats and then it can BP even though Last Resort won't normally work? Or does it need to use all of its moves (in order to make Last Resort valid) before the move is usable (making something like Protect + Z-Last Resort kind of necessary).
 
I just realized that the fact the Z-Move displays its name right before attacking is kind of similar to how the Mega Evolution cards are drawn in TCG.

Except for the part the Z-Move's name is not displayed in a different language, of course.
 
Here's a question, not sure if it has been asked. Flying Press is both a Fighting and Flying type move. So would you be able to use Flying Press for either a Fighting or Flying Type Z-move? Or would it only work for Fighting Z-Move since Flying Press is labeled as a Fighting Type move?
 
Here's a question, not sure if it has been asked. Flying Press is both a Fighting and Flying type move. So would you be able to use Flying Press for either a Fighting or Flying Type Z-move? Or would it only work for Fighting Z-Move since Flying Press is labeled as a Fighting Type move?
Flying Press is a Fighting-type move, and uses All-Out Plummeting, the Fighting-type Z move, and in this case is 175 BP Physical.

Nobody is talking about this? Z-Moves could useful on some Pokemon that has Special moves with 130 BP (Draco Meteor, Overheat and company). One example

Latios @ Dragonium Z (Soul Dew/Life Orb)
Evs: 4 Def, 252 SpA, 252 Spe
Ability: Levitate
-Draco Meteor
-Psychock
-Defog
-Thunderbolt/Surf/Earthquake/Recover

A 195 STAB Devastating Drake that doesn't lower your own stats is a move that very few things that aren't Fairy-types are going to take the attack. Latios (and even more Latias) loves reduced damage on Knock Off, (specially non-STAB Knock-Off), and Life Orb is not a good item on a Defogger.

I don't think this will be the standard set, but I think damaging-type Z-Move are not being paid any attention.

I think damaging Z-moves are "underrated". Having an item that can't be removed (which means that Knock Off is just 65 power, which is huge) and that there's a lot of moves with Negative effects that aren't apllied by its Z-move counterparts (But still boosts its power) are going to be more important than you may think.

However, I don't think Z-Moves aren't going to have near the presence of Mega Evolution and many teams won't use them. Reason: Risk of heavy resist/immunity. In lower tiers, specially RU and lowers, I expect damaging Z-move being more used.
 
Last edited:
Flying Press is a Fighting-type move, and uses All-Out Plummeting, the Fighting-type Z move, and in this case is 175 BP Physical.

Nobody is talking about this? Z-Moves could useful on some Pokemon that has Special moves with 130 BP (Draco Meteor, Overheat and company). One example

Latios @ Dragonium Z (Soul Dew/Life Orb)
Evs: 4 Def, 252 SpA, 252 Spe
Ability: Levitate
-Draco Meteor
-Psychock
-Defog
-Thunderbolt/Surf/Earthquake/Recover

A 195 STAB Devastating Drake that doesn't lower your own stats is a move that very few things that aren't Fairy-types are going to take the attack. Latios (and even more Latias) loves reduced damage on Knock Off, (specially non-STAB Knock-Off), and Life Orb is not a good item on a Defogger.

I don't think this will be the standard set, but I think damaging-type Z-Move are not being paid any attention.

I think damaging Z-moves are "underrated". Having an item that can't be removed (which means that Knock Off is just 65 power, which is huge) and that there's a lot of moves with Negative effects that aren't apllied by its Z-move counterparts (But still boosts its power) are going to be more important than you may think.

However, I don't think Z-Moves aren't going to have near the presence of Mega Evolution and many teams won't use them. Reason: Risk of heavy resist/immunity. In lower tiers, specially RU and lowers, I expect damaging Z-move being more used.
I can't speak for lower tiers (although in theory, I think you are right), but my biggest concern is how much more damage is a Z-Dragon move doing compared to a LO Draco? And is avoiding the SpAtk drop (or other downsides potentially) and the one-time nuke worth losing the extra damage over the whole battle? I think its really hard to say without testing and getting an actual feel for it in-game.
 
Imagine Mirror Moving Z-Splash.

+5 Attack in one turn and no HP loss unlike Belly Drum.
That doesn't work for two reasons. First, Mirror Move only works on moves that target other Pokémon, and Splash isn't one of them. Second, I'm fairly certain that the move called by Mirror Move is only converted to its Z-move equivalent if it's a damaging move. If it calls a status move, you don't get that move's Z-effect.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top