SM OU Without Warning | Mega-Gyarados + Zapdos SM OU Team RMT

How viable do you think Mega Gyarados is?

  • Not viable, other Dragon Dancers are better

    Votes: 1 2.0%
  • Ok, sometimes does nothing

    Votes: 24 49.0%
  • Viable, more people should use it

    Votes: 24 49.0%

  • Total voters
    49


Without Warning | Mega-Gyarados + Zapdos Bulky Offense


Introduction

"After 7 years of competitive Pokemon battling, I've finally realized that I am no good at it. So instead of grinding hours away on the Pokemon Showdown website ladder to only peak in the 1600s, I've decided to create teams for people, who can more effectively use the team, to use. (And, I find building a team more enjoyable than getting beaten again on the ladder)"

With Pokemon Ultra Sun and Moon coming out within a week, I feel the need to give Pokemon Sun and Moon a parting gift as we prepare to receive the new game (and with it a new metagame). While watching Blunder and Pokeaim videos, I realized that the metagame was considerably weak to Mega Gyarados. With the decrease of usage of Tangrowth and Toxapex, Gyarados may have a chance to shine.

I've always thought of Gyarados as a cool mon, and with the anime episode where Misty's Gyarados Mega evolved, I knew I needed to make a team. Flyinium Z Gyarados is quite prevalent because of its dual Water-Flying STAB that allows it to take down Landorus-Therian and Tangrowth, but Mega Gyarados is getting no love. (Ever since the release of Mega Gyarados, people have been disappointed with its speed and its typing.) But now, I think Mega Gyarados can rise.

Here are some preferences when I team build,

"1. Bulky Offense - I really like the Bulky Offense archetype (my two other RMT teams are also Bulky Offense), because I'm not good enough to play with Hyper Offense, Balance is too bland for me, Stall is a no go.
2. Volt Turn - The team needs to have at least 2 volt turners to keep up offensive momentum and pressure
3. Aesthetic - I always need my team to look nice at team preview, no ugly or discolored Pokemon. So I usually use standard Pokemon, like Landorus or any of the Tapus.
4. Standard - I think my builds are too standard and predictable, so if y'all can help me with a hidden tech that would be greatly appreciated."

Squadron


nightmare (Gyarados-Mega) @ Gyaradosite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 60 SpD / 196 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Crunch
- Ice Fang
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance

Gyarados can either serve as an early game breaker or more often as a late game sweeper. Its excellent bulk and typing allows it to set up on common Pokemon, and survive revenge killers. Crunch for Dark STAB, Ice Fang over Waterfall because of the presence of Keldeo and the ability to destroy Grass types, and Earthquake for Electric types. Dragon Dance for set-up.



ric flair drip (Zapdos) @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 240 Def / 20 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Discharge
- Heat Wave
- Roost
- Defog

Defensive Zapdos forms a potent core with Gyarados. It pressures the Grass and Water types that give Gyarados trouble. Discharge for Electric STAB and the juicy 30% paralysis chance, Heat Wave for Ferrothorn and pressuring Grass types. Roost for recovery, and Defog to get rid of Stealth Rocks for Gyarados.


mad stalkers (Tapu Bulu) @ Fightinium Z
Ability: Grassy Surge
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Horn Leech
- Superpower
- Stone Edge

Z Move Tapu Bulu also pressures the Grass and Steel types that Gyarados has problems with. With the combination of Swords Dance and Z-Move Superpower (All-Out Pummeling), Bulu is able to weaken common walls such as Tangrowth and Skarmory, for a late game Gyarados Sweep. Horn Leech for Grass STAB against Water types, Stone Edge for Charizard and other Flying types.


rap saved me (Heatran) @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 220 SpD / 40 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Flash Cannon
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock

Sp Def Heatran works well in conjunction with Grassy Terrain and Tapu Bulu. Heatran provides Stealth Rocks, and hurts Stall with Taunt. It also patches the fairy (Tapu Lele) weakness, and rounds out the Fire-Water-Grass core with Gyarados and Bulu. Lava Plume and Flash Cannon for STAB.


ghostface killers (Zygarde) @ Choice Band
Ability: Aura Break
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Thousand Arrows
- Extreme Speed
- Outrage
- Toxic

Choice Band Zygarde is used also as an early game wallbreaker to kill Toxapex and weaken Grass types to allow Gyarados to sweep. Also, Zygarde rounds out a Dragon-Fairy-Steel core. Thousand Arrows for a powerful no drawback STAB, Extreme Speed for priority, Outrage for a last ditch Dragon STAB. Toxic to weaken Tangrowth with residual damage.


disrespectful (Keldeo-Resolute) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Hydro Pump
- Secret Sword
- Hidden Power [Poison]

The team was overall really slow, so a Scarfer was necessary. I've always used Keldeo as a late game cleaner. If Gyarados is unable to sweep, Keldeo is able to clean after all the opposing mons that resist water are weakened. Scald and Secret Sword for a no drawback STAB, Hydro Pump for a stronger STAB. HP Poison for the Tapu Bulu switch in.

Conclusion

In conclusion, my team is a bulky offense built around Mega Gyarados's ability to sweep. Every member of the team form defensive cores around each other. Tapu Bulu and Zygarde pressure Grass types so that Gyarados can win. (And if Gyarados doesn't, Keldeo can clean.)

I have tested this team on the ladder at around 1600, and I can win against certain teams. However, I think the team is too slow, and too weak to common threats.

---


"And form of help on this team is appreciated. I'm not going to be the one to use this team, it's more for the community."

Importable: http://pokepast.es/7d9093f582d23dfb
 

dom

Banned deucer.
hey man cool team.

one of the biggest issues i see with this team is that you have a lot of trouble dealing with offensive zapdos. with its ability to pressure more than half of this team, including your main breakers being tapu bulu, gyarados, and zygarde so it is important to have a countermeasure for this pokemon. while you do have heatran, that isnt really pressuring zapdos since it gets worn down by rocks + thunderbolt / discharge and the best you can do back is lava plume burn. bulky grasses are also pretty troublesome for this team due to the fact that your only real answer to things like ferrothorn, mega venusaur, tangrowth, and even offensive tapu bulu is only zapdos because heatran gets warn down by hazards + leech seed / eq / just dies to superpower. aside from that the team looks pretty good and does a good job of supporting mega gyarados.

-->
| change tapu bulu to kyurem-black | as i previously stated, offensive zapdos and bulky grasses are very hard for this team to deal with. with the addition of kyurem-back things like mega venusaur tangrowth and tapu bulu no longer become a problem, and you can also use hp fire on this set to help deal with ferrothorn which is a common mega gyarados counter.

-->
| change zapdos to tapu fini | with the removal of tapu bulu, pokemon such as keldeo become a huge threat and annoyance for this team to deal with. tapu fini lets you keep the defog support that zapdos provides for tapu mega gyarados while also giving you the ability to beat annoying waters that come with the removal of tapu bulu, and lets you pressure other things like mega sableye.

smaller changes

  • | change heatran set | changing the heatran set to magma trap allows you to wear down pokemon that mega gyarados have trouble with much easier. one example is tapu fini, which while you dont ohko with z solar beam you can definitely pressure the switch with rocks + magma storm + earth power damage putting it in range of mega gyarados' hits.
  • | change ice fang to waterfall | while ice fang is useful for grass types, waterfall is a much better move to hit things like clefable, and volcarona much harder while also just providing a flinch chance which is good for pokemon like celesteela.

importable
 
as partys over has already mentioned. switching ice fang for waterfall would be better for gyarados as ice fang doesn't really give you an edge against the bulky grass types that you normally see in ou . while waterfall has a chance to flinch while providing a strong stab attack

+1 252 Atk Mold Breaker Gyarados-Mega Ice Fang vs. 252 HP / 28 Def Assault Vest Tangrowth: 196-232 (48.5 - 57.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252 Atk Mold Breaker Gyarados-Mega Ice Fang vs. 248 HP / 88 Def Defensive Venusaur-Mega: 190-224 (52.3 - 61.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

+1 252 Atk Mold Breaker Gyarados-Mega Ice Fang vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Assault Vest Tapu Bulu: 214-254 (62.3 - 74%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Grassy Terrain recovery


the possibility of a two hit ko becomes even slimmer if your opponent brings in their grass type while your grassy terrain is still up

 
Hey chasedown i really like ur team, I feel like it has great synergy and a lot of thought has been put into it, however, I think some minor things should be changed to get the most out of this team.

Some threats i noticed were Tapu Koko, Tapu Bulu, SD Mega Scizor, and Kyurem-B, just to name some. I tried to patch up these weaknesses as well as possible.

Overview



  • First off i'd suggest changing Mega Gyarados's set from Ice Fang to Taunt, this lets Mega Gyarados annoy stall a lot better, because it already ignores Unaware from Quagsire and Clefable allowing to properly break through Stall when used with Waterfall, I think u should also consider using the aforementioned Waterfall over Earthquake to hit Skarmory and Clefable harder but both are good options here.


  • I would consider changing Zapdos to Choice Scarf Kartana, this improves ur match up against Tapu Lele, Tapu Koko, and Kyurem-B, while also pressuring Water-types for Mega Gyarados, similarly to Zapdos. It also maintains ur ability to Defog away hazards, but this should only be done when applying offensive pressure.

  • Tapu Bulu should imo be changed to Assault Vest because of its ability to check Tapu Koko and being a soft-check to Tapu Lele, it also provides ur team with useful utility in Nature's Madness wearing down otherwise troublesome Pokemon like Zapdos, Tangrowth, and Mega Venusaur.


  • Specially defensive Heatran has a hard time to check Pokemon like Tapu Bulu and SD Mega Scizor, because it can't outspeed either, which means it will get hit by Superpower from Tapu Bulu and it can also be annoyed by SD Scizor with Knock Off, which can remove ur item. SD Scizor also overwhelms Specially Defensive Heatran with minor team support because it can keep wearing it down with Knock Off to the point where a +2 Knock Off will KO. This is why I think u should change Heatran to a faster spread, allowing it to check Tapu Bulu and Mega Scizor easier. I also think Stealth Rock should be changed to Toxic to annoy Stall teams a bit easier. Earth Power is also worth a consideration over Flash Cannon because of its ability to hit opposing Heatran, but considering ur Tapu Lele match up I think Flash Cannon is fine.

  • I would suggest changing Zygarde to defensive Landorus-T, this gives u access Stealth Rock again, while also being able to check a lot of Physical attackers. Stone Edge should be ran over Hidden Power Ice I feel like because of ur teams weakness to Mega Pinsir, Mega Gyarados can already take advantage of Landorus-T if Landorus-T is unboosted, making Hidden Power Ice not mandatory.


  • I think changing Keldeo to Calm Mind Taunt will greatly improve ur team as I changed ur secondary wincon in SD Bulu, this Keldeo set can properly lure Water-resists like Tangrowth, Mega Venusaur, and Toxapex for Mega Gyarados to ease up a sweep with it, which I think is of great value.
Overview
<<import

Summary of changes
I changed Mega Gyarados to carry Taunt and Waterfall to ease up the Stall matchup. Kartana should be ran over Zapdos because of its ability to deal with common threats to ur team, while still maintaining the ability to remove hazards. Tapu Bulu was changed to Assault Vest to allow it to check Tapu Koko a lot better while also soft checking Tapu Lele, it also provides useful utility with Natures Madness which lets Mega Gyarados break through the opposing team easier. A faster Heatran allows u to check Tapu Bulu and Mega Scizor better and carries Toxic instead of Stealth Rock to annoy Stall a lot better, Flash Cannon can also be changed to Earth Power but this is optional considering ur Tapu Lele matchup. Zygarde was changed to Landorus-T as it gives u access to Stealth Rock and can check a wide variety of Physical Attackers, Stone Edge is ran over Hidden Power Ice to properly check Mega Pinsir because ur team is very weak to it. Keldeo was changed to Calm Mind Taunt because it gives a solid secondary win con that can weaken Water-resists for Mega Gyarados to ease up a sweep.

The only thing i think ur match up became worse against is Kartana since I removed Zapdos. It can easily plow through over half ur team and only has 1 way to get revenge killed by ur own Kartana.

Really like ur references to 21 Savage's new album :]

Be sure to let me know what u think of my rate and what I could improve for the next team I might rate as i seriously want to contribute the best I can.
 
Last edited:
Update

Thank you partys over , CreamPuffs , and ThiccTornadus for helping me improve the quality of the team.

However, I still have some slight reservations about your suggestions, and I'm unsure whether the edits will create new problems with the team. Instead of addressing each contributor separately, I'll attempt to look at the suggestions in terms of each Pokemon, and how these suggestions will change the structure of the team.

| Gyarados

Initially, when I built the team, I would play with Gyarados's moveset in mind, as it is the main sweeper for the team. If I saw an opposing Tangrowth, I would first weaken the Tangrowth to whatever percent before setting up with Gyarados. (Therefore, I thought Ice Fang, Earthquake, Crunch allowed it to hit almost everything for super effective damage, allowing for an easier sweep.) I though Waterfall was not necessary because Keldeo could threaten out what Gyarados could not.
  • Moveset: After considering Waterfall over Ice Fang, I realize the increased capability of Gyarados to sweep. However, I'm not so sure about Taunt over Earthquake because Gyarados loses the ability to OHKO Tapu Koko, for instance (although Zygarde already has Ground coverage).
  • Speed: I'm currently running 271 speed to outpace Lopunny after a Dragon Dance, and placing the rest of the EVs into Special Defense so Gyarados can take Special hits even better. However, should I run 252 max speed? In other words, should I be worried about Beedrill or Sceptile being too prevalent?
Gyarados-Mega @ Gyaradosite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 60 SpD / 196 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Crunch
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Dragon Dance

| Zapdos

For the team, I choose Zapdos because of its ability to Defog and its Electric typing. I've never had a team without an Electric type, and I feel comfortable with a powerful Electric type on the team. Then, I realize how weak Zapdos actually was, both defensively and offensively.
  • Kartana: I'm not so sure about the replacement of Zapdos with Kartana, and the subsequent replacement of Tapu Bulu with Tapu Fini. I think the idea is great, but I dislike both Pokemon. I think Kartana is too frail and hard to use (especially with Defog) and Tapu Fini
| Tapu Bulu

I've only recently started to use Tapu Bulu, and I'm really surprised by the raw power that it brings. However, All-Out Pummeling is not getting much use because it might be too predictable.
  • I'm not sure about replacing Bulu with Kyurem, but I did like the suggestion and I will replace Keldeo with Kyurem.
  • Also, I'm wary about the Assault Vest set. I acknowledge its pros (its ability to check Tapu Lele and Keldeo), but I think I will miss its power and ability to set-up against walls.
Tapu Bulu @ Assault Vest
Ability: Grassy Surge
EVs: 248 HP / 60 Atk / 56 SpD / 144 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Horn Leech
- Wood Hammer
- Superpower
- Nature's Madness

| Heatran
  • I like the suggestion of using Heatran to beat stall and Scizor by ThiccTornadus and also the Z-Move idea by partys over to trap Toxapex and Tapu Fini (now that Bulu is AV and not Z-Move).
Heatran @ Grassium-Z
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Magma Storm
- Flash Cannon
- Solar Beam
- Toxic

| Zygarde ==>
| Landorus-Therian

Ever since the introduction of Zygarde into the metagame as a viable member of a team, I've been using its Banded version. I choose it for this team because I'm really comfortable with it and what it does. However, I realize that Zygarde's ability to do its job is hindered.
  • Zygarde will be replaced by Offensive Landorus-Therian with Stealth Rocks. Landorus-Therian does the same things as Zygarde, except it actually has the ability to break past common Grass types with Flyinium-Z Fly (Supersonic Skystrike). I'm not so sure about Defensive Landorus-Therian; I think it invites in Greninja and other Water types because it is not strong enough.
  • I'm using Smack Down over Stone Edge or HP [Ice] because it pressures Celesteela and Zapdos more.
Landorus-Therian @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Fly
- Smack Down
- Stealth Rock

| Keldeo ==>
| Kyurem-Black

I love Scarf Keldeo because of how reliable it is and how comfortable I am with it. But, with the introduction of Waterfall into Gyarados's moveset, Keldeo, I believe, is no longer needed and another Scarfer should be introduced. Also, the removal of Ice Fang from Gyarados's moveset is complemented perfectly with the introduction of Kyurem.

Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Hidden Power Fire
- Roost

  • Kyurem-Black is a reliable, hard-hitting wall breaker that pressures Grass and Water types. Also, it threatens all the Pokemon Keldeo threatened (Landorus-Therian, etc.) It also rounds out the Dragon-Fairy-Steel core filling in the place of Zygarde.
  • However, with the introduction of Kyurem, another Scarfer is needed, and more answers to Fighting types (such as Lopunny and Medicham).
Synopsis

___


These changes (although they are for the betterment of the team) has destroyed the integrity of the original team. I'm curious where the synthesis of our ideas will become.

Further Questions
  1. What do you think of the new changes?
  2. Who should Zapdos be replaced with? I still need a Defogger on the team
  3. Who should be the new Scarfer?
 
Hi, playing M-Gyarados with full speed invest is a better idea in many cases. You can outspeed some threats at 0, like Tapu Bulu if you play Ice Fang, Heatran, wich is very often max speed and can toxic Gyara or sub if the opponent predict DD or burn with the rare will-o-wisp. Also you can outspeed Adamant SR Excadrill outside of sand. Beedrill is not common but it would be frustrating to lose face of it just because you prefere spend 60EV in SpeDef. Even if these cases are not very common, it's more profitable than a poor investissement in SpeDef that Gyara doesn't need anyway.
 

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