Other PU - Classics - My first RMT

[OriginalOne]

CLASSICS

Hello bros! I realized that i need help with teambuilding and starting to post here would be fun, so here it is, my first RMT.

First of all we have
THE FROG

I was just looking through the tier and i found this thing, took a look at its stats and it seemed decent enough to use! Upon further inspection i realized i have a few options to go with, i decided to go with a specially defensive set, Other options would have been offensive AV or LO.

MADVILLAINY (Politoed) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Toxic
- Protect
- Perish Song

I chose Politoad with the intention to make a FWG core, and Politoad seemed like a good special wall, as it walls special variations of Poliwrath, and also is a decent switch to most special fire and ice types.

Encore is to lock opposing Pokemon to Stealth rock, recover or a set up move and cripple them. Rest is there just to get recovery and also get rid off annoying status moves. I chose Psychic over ice beam because now i can do something back to special Poliwraths and Arboks. Scald was a mandatory STAB-move, decent offensive stat combined with the burn chance makes it quite effective.

Next up we have the
THE HORSE

Continuing with the FWG core, we have the powerhouse Rapidash, in my opinion one best Pokemon is PU.

m.A.A.d (Rapidash) @ Flame Plate
Ability: Flash Fire
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Wild Charge
- Low Kick
- Drill Run

There is three good sets for Rapidash, and those are Life Orb, Choice Scarfed and the Flame Plate set, after suggestions i changed this to Flame Plate from CB. I needed a fast stallbreaking mon, and Rapidash succeeds in that with its incredible power.

Flare Blitz is mandatory stab again, very powerful, just be cautious with the recoil. Wild Charge takes care most of the bulky water-types that would like to switch in to Flare blitz, like Pelipper, Carracosta or Poliwrath. Low Kick is for Golem, Bastidion, Gigalith, Probopass and other bulky heavy rock types and normal types, as Low Kick 2HKO most of them reliably as it hits harder than Drill Run. Drill Run is for other fire types like Flareons and Heatmors as it can do good damage to them.
Shiny for obvious reasons.

And finishing the holy trio, we have
THE STONER

I had Meganium before Tangela, as i strayed away from Tangela because of its terrible special SpDef stat, but upon testing i realized that Tangela actually fits the role of physically defensive much better than Meganium.

INFAMOUS (Tangela) @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Leech Seed
- Sleep Powder
- Hidden Power [Ice] / Sludge Bomb
- Giga Drain

Leech Seed to provide recovery for Tangela and teammates. Sleep Powder is to cripple offensive and defensive threats, like maybe flying- or ice-types that like so switch in. HP Ice is so i can hit opposing grass types, as well as flying-types. Giga Drain is just mandatory STAB.

Next we roll in the
THE CUDDLER

I realized i need entry hazards like Stealth Rock, and immediately i thought of my old friend Golem. Now, Golem is a fantastic pokemon, great offensive stats and a fitting movepool with EQ, Stone Edge and Sucker Punch for strong priority. I decided to roll with the Custap Berry set, which has caught my opponent off guard many times.

Goin' Off (Golem) @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Sucker Punch

Speed is to outspeed uninvested base 75's

Stealth Rock is a great entry hazard to weaken my opponents team. Earthquake is a good STAB that hits extremely hard on anything that doesn't resist. Stone Edge makes the EdgeQuake combo that hits most thing neutrally. Sucker Punch is great priority to pick off weakened Pokemon.

Then we have the
THE MASTER

I knew i needed another fast sweeper, and i think unprepared teams will get torn to shreds by Kadabra, as it has great speed, power and good coverage.

It was a hard choice between the LO and a Focus Sash, but i went with the Sash as it provides more longevity and priority will not be able to take me down in one hit.

Breaking Atoms (Kadabra) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Shadow Ball
- Hidden Power [Fighting] / Thunderwave

Calm Mind is chosen because it is really good depending on the situation, if it looks like there is no priority in your opponents team and it is weakened enough, then just CM and sweep with the help of the Sash. Psyshock is just powerful STAB. Shadow Ball for other Psychic types like Grumpig. HP Fighting is just a filler, other option was T-Wave which would have trolled the sucker punch users, but HP hits Mightyena and bulky Rock-types which might be a problem otherwise.

Then comes the last but not the least

THE BOID

Unfezant used to be my scarf user but i decided to replace it with Dodrio because of power and speed (thank you for the suggestions). Dodrio hits a nice speed tier and packs quite a punch with STAB Brave Bird.

Dodrio @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Early Bird
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Return
- Brave Bird
- Knock Off
- Toxic

Return is mandatory STAB and a recoil free move to save HP. Brave Bird for another strong STAB and to hit bulky walls like Gourgeist really hard. Knock Off for obvious reasons, a great move to cripple walls and pick off ghost and psychic types. Toxic for spreading the love.




THREATLIST:

Vanillux can hit Politoad with freeze-Dry and Ice Beam rest of my team, a big problem is Rapidash is weak.

If Meganium is out this thing can be a pain is the ass to kill.



Ps. i am sorry for all the spelling errors and such, its 4AM as i im writing this so im a bit tired.

​

 

[Twix]

Politoed / Rapidash / Meganium / Kadabra / Golem / Unfezant

The thing I mainly see from your team is that you're using a bunch of outclassed Pokemon, which aren't benefiting your team as much as the other Pokemon would.

Some Pokemon changes I would suggest are:

• Dodrio > Unfezant. Dodrio has a higher Speed, as well as access to Brave Bird, while lacking U-turn, making it a much better fit.

Dodrio

Dodrio @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Early Bird
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Double-Edge
- Knock Off
- Toxic

• Tangela > Meganium. Tangela is much more bulky than Meganium, as well as having access to Regenerator, while lacking Dragon Tail. Tangela also offers a better check to Barbaracle

Tangela

Tangela @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sleep Powder
- Synthesis
- Hidden Power [Fire]

• Specially Defensive Pelipper > Politoed. In all honesty, Pelipper is so much better than Politoed, and can also take on Poliwrath better, and can offer Defog and U-turn support.

Pelipper

Pelipper @ Leftovers
Ability: Keen Eye
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Defog
- Scald
- Roost
- Air Slash

Looking at the sets you already have, a few changes need to be made as well.

• Even with a Custap Berry, Golem should be running Max Speed to outpace Pelipper and other univested base 75 Pokemon and below.

Golem

Golem @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Sucker Punch

 

[MZ]

Hey OriginalOne and welcome to smogon! Twix's changes are a good start but I have a few more things to say about the team. I'll also go into a little more depth because I'm not sure how much you know about the tier, because a lot of the comments in your RMT aren't really close to being true (i.e. Rapidash has 3 sets and that's CB, LO, and Flame Plate- it actually has Flame Plate and Scarf for standard, viable sets).

For your Unfezant, I agree with Twix's recommendation of running Dodrio, as the higher base speed and access to a better Flying STAB move are much more important than the tiny bit of attack lost. I'm going to suggest Baton Pass instead of Toxic. It can better fulfill the momentum niche and Toxic is mainly to cripple some walls that your team already handles well, like Carracosta. You alternately might prefer Modest Scarf Chatot, which is an excellent breaker alongside Kadabra, as they support each other really well.

Speaking of Kadabra, Hidden Power Fighting is a must over Shadow Ball to hit Probopass and Pawniard, the coverage is too important to miss. In the last slot, Shadow Ball / Encore are what you'll want to run. Thunder Wave is good but doesnt really work well on Calm Mind sets while Dazzling Gleam is far worse coverage than Hidden Power Fighting. Shadow Ball is very nice to hit Misdreavus and Grumpig which are currently really annoying, while Encore can turn slower Pokemon into setup fodder for Kadabra. If you go with Chatot, definitely use Shadow Ball as a way to lure and weaken Misdreavus. I know you already have Shadow Ball but the different placing is just to emphasize how important Hidden Power Fighting is to run.

I totally agree with Twix's set changes to Golem and Meganium. Since he didn't explain, Tangela's extra bulk is massively important, as it makes it a much more reliable answer to breakers like Stoutland and Ursaring coupled with Regenerator, as well as getting Sleep Powder. However, I don't think Golem fits well on a team without removal that's so weak to Steels so I think you'll get more out of Probopass over Golem. Probo can trap and remove Pawniard and other Probopass with its Magnet Pull set, leaving Unfezant/Dodrio/Chatot and Kadabra much more room to attack, while still providing similar support for the team. Probo helps out versus offensive Ice-types which can give the team issues. It also gives you another Piloswine check and Stoutland check, which is really nice. Oh, and a Zebstrika switchin for extra stuff.

Probopass Set

Probopass @ Air Balloon
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 172 HP / 252 SpA / 84 Spe
Modest Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Flash Cannon
- Volt Switch
- Earth Power

This is a little more personal preference but make Rapidash the Flame Plate set with Morning Sun over Low Kick because Choice Band just locks you into one move and makes it much harder to break. Your set is usable, it's just really mediocre imo.

In the final slot, I'm going to recommend you actually keep Politoed :O Twix sucks. Pelipper makes you overall weaker to offensive Water-types and Fire-types while Politoed is a more solid counter, although the lack of recovery is annoying. If you find that it's underperforming, certainly try out Pelipper, but Politoed is also what the team was built around and I like it's use here. However, the set is an issue. Psychic just isn't really good coverage and running Rest without Sleep Talk or an Aromatherapy/Heal Bell user is normally pretty bad. I think the set that benefits you the most right here is Scald/Toxic/Protect/Perish Song or Encore. Politoed doesn't have too many good other options, but this set should wall/cripple all the things you need it too.

Your new team will have somewhat of a Regice and Machoke weakness, and I don't see a good way to fix that without significantly compromising the structure. However, it can definitely be played around and neither will straight 6-0 or anything. These are a lot of changes, but for the most part it's just fixing up sets or making a 1-1 replacement, and the overall team structure that you made is basically the same, and it should work well. I hope this helped and good luck with the team!

 

[OriginalOne]

Politoed / Rapidash / Meganium / Kadabra / Golem / Unfezant

The thing I mainly see from your team is that you're using a bunch of outclassed Pokemon, which aren't benefiting your team as much as the other Pokemon would.

Some Pokemon changes I would suggest are:

• Dodrio > Unfezant. Dodrio has a higher Speed, as well as access to Brave Bird, while lacking U-turn, making it a much better fit.

Dodrio

Dodrio @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Early Bird
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Double-Edge
- Knock Off
- Toxic

• Tangela > Meganium. Tangela is much more bulky than Meganium, as well as having access to Regenerator, while lacking Dragon Tail. Tangela also offers a better check to Barbaracle

Tangela

Tangela @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sleep Powder
- Synthesis
- Hidden Power [Fire]

• Specially Defensive Pelipper > Politoed. In all honesty, Pelipper is so much better than Politoed, and can also take on Poliwrath better, and can offer Defog and U-turn support.

Pelipper

Pelipper @ Leftovers
Ability: Keen Eye
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Defog
- Scald
- Roost
- Air Slash

Looking at the sets you already have, a few changes need to be made as well.

• Even with a Custap Berry, Golem should be running Max Speed to outpace Pelipper and other univested base 75 Pokemon and below.

Golem

Golem @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Sucker Punch

Thank you for the suggestions, I do agree with replacing Meganium with Tangela, but i just hate that Tangela has absolutely no special defense.
Dodrio over Unfezant is something i anticipated because Dodrio does outclass Unfezant, but the recoil from Brave Bird and Stealth Rock is very annoying to me. Plus, Unfezant has a slight amount of more bulk. SpDef Pelipper over Politoad might work out, but i hate the 4x electric weakness and the Stealth Rock annoy Pelipper also (plus Pelippers sprite is ugly as hell).
You are right about the Golem set, changed it to max speed.

Thank you for the response!

 

[OriginalOne]

Hey OriginalOne and welcome to smogon! Twix's changes are a good start but I have a few more things to say about the team. I'll also go into a little more depth because I'm not sure how much you know about the tier, because a lot of the comments in your RMT aren't really close to being true (i.e. Rapidash has 3 sets and that's CB, LO, and Flame Plate- it actually has Flame Plate and Scarf for standard, viable sets).

For your Unfezant, I agree with Twix's recommendation of running Dodrio, as the higher base speed and access to a better Flying STAB move are much more important than the tiny bit of attack lost. I'm going to suggest Baton Pass instead of Toxic. It can better fulfill the momentum niche and Toxic is mainly to cripple some walls that your team already handles well, like Carracosta. You alternately might prefer Modest Scarf Chatot, which is an excellent breaker alongside Kadabra, as they support each other really well.

Speaking of Kadabra, Hidden Power Fighting is a must over Shadow Ball to hit Probopass and Pawniard, the coverage is too important to miss. In the last slot, Shadow Ball / Encore are what you'll want to run. Thunder Wave is good but doesnt really work well on Calm Mind sets while Dazzling Gleam is far worse coverage than Hidden Power Fighting. Shadow Ball is very nice to hit Misdreavus and Grumpig which are currently really annoying, while Encore can turn slower Pokemon into setup fodder for Kadabra. If you go with Chatot, definitely use Shadow Ball as a way to lure and weaken Misdreavus. I know you already have Shadow Ball but the different placing is just to emphasize how important Hidden Power Fighting is to run.

I totally agree with Twix's set changes to Golem and Meganium. Since he didn't explain, Tangela's extra bulk is massively important, as it makes it a much more reliable answer to breakers like Stoutland and Ursaring coupled with Regenerator, as well as getting Sleep Powder. However, I don't think Golem fits well on a team without removal that's so weak to Steels so I think you'll get more out of Probopass over Golem. Probo can trap and remove Pawniard and other Probopass with its Magnet Pull set, leaving Unfezant/Dodrio/Chatot and Kadabra much more room to attack, while still providing similar support for the team. Probo helps out versus offensive Ice-types which can give the team issues. It also gives you another Piloswine check and Stoutland check, which is really nice. Oh, and a Zebstrika switchin for extra stuff.

Probopass Set

Probopass @ Air Balloon
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 172 HP / 252 SpA / 84 Spe
Modest Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Flash Cannon
- Volt Switch
- Earth Power

This is a little more personal preference but make Rapidash the Flame Plate set with Morning Sun over Low Kick because Choice Band just locks you into one move and makes it much harder to break. Your set is usable, it's just really mediocre imo.

In the final slot, I'm going to recommend you actually keep Politoed :O Twix sucks. Pelipper makes you overall weaker to offensive Water-types and Fire-types while Politoed is a more solid counter, although the lack of recovery is annoying. If you find that it's underperforming, certainly try out Pelipper, but Politoed is also what the team was built around and I like it's use here. However, the set is an issue. Psychic just isn't really good coverage and running Rest without Sleep Talk or an Aromatherapy/Heal Bell user is normally pretty bad. I think the set that benefits you the most right here is Scald/Toxic/Protect/Perish Song or Encore. Politoed doesn't have too many good other options, but this set should wall/cripple all the things you need it too.

Your new team will have somewhat of a Regice and Machoke weakness, and I don't see a good way to fix that without significantly compromising the structure. However, it can definitely be played around and neither will straight 6-0 or anything. These are a lot of changes, but for the most part it's just fixing up sets or making a 1-1 replacement, and the overall team structure that you made is basically the same, and it should work well. I hope this helped and good luck with the team!

Hello Megazard and thank you for the response. I do agree with you mostly about your suggestions, i cant believe that i didn't think of HP Fighting when building.
I am debating over the Probopass, while it does bring a Ice-type check, i feel like the 4x weakeness to fighting, lack of priority and pretty poor offensive stats hurt my team. I like the electric immunity and the Custap set has been effective so far. Probopass does have a fairly decent typing and could work out beautifully is certain situation. Hmm, cant decide.

Morning Sun over Low Kick is preference really, i like the surprise factor in Low Kick as it can punish thing like Probopass. Changed set to Flame Plate as it is less fun set, but more effective.

 

[WhiteDMist]

Just pointing out the difference in power:
252 Atk Dodrio Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 218-260 (58.2 - 69.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Unfezant Aerial Ace vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 114-134 (30.4 - 35.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Unfezant Aerial Ace vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super on a critical hit: 168-200 (44.9 - 53.4%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Recoil may be irritating, but the sheer difference in power is noticeable, where power is vital for a revenge killer to be effective. Even a crit Aerial Ace is lower in power.

252 Atk Unfezant Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk: 124-147 (29.3 - 34.8%) -- 100% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Unfezant Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk on a critical hit: 186-220 (44 - 52.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Dodrio Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk: 120-142 (28.4 - 33.6%) -- 96.3% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

Normal STAB is much more promising, but the difference is rather minimal without a crit.

Knock Off has more utility than Night Slash, so the extra power on crits doesn't particularly change anything. U-turn is a point in Unfezant's favor, but seeing as you still end up switching out and taking SR damage, the longevity argument kind of weakens as a result (plus it forces your switch-in to take the attack, and you have better hope that its not an Freeze Dry user).

Also pointing out that right now, Dodrio can switch in on Stealth Rock 4 times and live, while your Unfezant can only switch in 3 times. At the least, move those 4 HP EVs to a defense stat.

Drill and and Low Kick are both 4x super effective against Probopass. Bad example. Golem and Lickilicky are a better reason.

 

[OriginalOne]

Just pointing out the difference in power:
252 Atk Dodrio Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 218-260 (58.2 - 69.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Unfezant Aerial Ace vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 114-134 (30.4 - 35.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Unfezant Aerial Ace vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super on a critical hit: 168-200 (44.9 - 53.4%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Recoil may be irritating, but the sheer difference in power is noticeable, where power is vital for a revenge killer to be effective. Even a crit Aerial Ace is lower in power.

252 Atk Unfezant Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk: 124-147 (29.3 - 34.8%) -- 100% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Unfezant Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk on a critical hit: 186-220 (44 - 52.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Dodrio Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Stunfisk: 120-142 (28.4 - 33.6%) -- 96.3% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

Normal STAB is much more promising, but the difference is rather minimal without a crit.

Knock Off has more utility than Night Slash, so the extra power on crits doesn't particularly change anything. U-turn is a point in Unfezant's favor, but seeing as you still end up switching out and taking SR damage, the longevity argument kind of weakens as a result (plus it forces your switch-in to take the attack, and you have better hope that its not an Freeze Dry user).

Also pointing out that right now, Dodrio can switch in on Stealth Rock 4 times and live, while your Unfezant can only switch in 3 times. At the least, move those 4 HP EVs to a defense stat.

Drill and and Low Kick are both 4x super effective against Probopass. Bad example. Golem and Lickilicky are a better reason.

Thank you Mist for responding.
Wow you really opened my eyes to why Dodrio is a better choice after all, definitely going to change that now.
Thank you for the constructive criticism, i do appreciate it.
This is my first post, and i am not the most skilled teambuilder and a bit unfamiliar with the PU tier, so i apologize for being incorrect at times.

 

[WhiteDMist]

Thank you Mist for responding.
Wow you really opened my eyes to why Dodrio is a better choice after all, definitely going to change that now.
Thank you for the constructive criticism, i do appreciate it.
This is my first post, and i am not the most skilled teambuilder and a bit unfamiliar with the PU tier, so i apologize for being incorrect at times.

Don't think of it as incorrect, just think of it as a learning process. I wasn't actually taking sides, I was giving you a comparison and informing you what attributes the Pokemon had that differentiated them. Sadly, I believe that the set needs to have Toxic over Baton Pass, or else become Double Edge / Drill Peck / Knock Off / Baton Pass: Brave Bird and Baton Pass are illegal together iirc. Hence why they are not on the analysis together, as Baton Pass is such a good move otherwise. :( I may be wrong, feel free to test it out on Showdown though.

 

[MZ]

The set does become illegal, I was suggesting baton pass (with that set following) merely as a replacement to the lost u-turn with the substitution, using toxic and keeping brave bird also works fine