np: Doubles OU Stage 4 - Infamous | Jirachi (Stays in DOU) | Swagger is Banned

Status
Not open for further replies.

ryo yamada2001

ryo yamada2001
is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
so when's the thunder wave vote. If were going to ban a move that's less problematic than thunder wave surely we should be voting on the one that's more of a pain in the ass by every sense of the word, no? Higher chance to not move, it slows your pokemon down, and it doesn't ware off like swagger does so surely people must want this banned to?
the difference between Swagger and Thunder Wave basically is that Swagger makes you unable to move 50% of the time, with no other competitive effects, whereas Thunder Wave is used for speed control rather than complete RNG.
 

Mizuhime

Did I mistake you for a sign from God?
is a Top Tutor Alumnusis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
the difference between Swagger and Thunder Wave basically is that Swagger makes you unable to move 50% of the time, with no other competitive effects, whereas Thunder Wave is used for speed control rather than complete RNG.
That's not how game mechanics work, it's literally only 50% for the first turn it's active.
 
in memorium, my favorite ruseroom team.
Hoopa-Unbound @ Lum Berry
Ability: Magician
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 1 Spe
- Hyperspace Fury
- Zen Headbutt
- Trick Room
- Protect

Kangaskhan @ Kangaskhanite
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 1 Spe
- Fake Out
- Power-Up Punch
- Return
- Sucker Punch

Amoonguss @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Spore
- Swagger
- Rage Powder
- Sludge Bomb

Heatran @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 8 Spe
- Heat Wave
- Earth Power
- Ancient Power
- Protect

Landorus-Therian @ Lum Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 1 Spe
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Explosion
- Protect

Gengar @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp
- Trick Room
- Protect
 

Matame

New Rules
people have clicked ice beam for freezes as well, or thunderbolt for paras, do you want those moves to get banned?
I don't think I worded myself clearly. If people have an ring related wincon(whether it be an ice beam freeze, twave para or full confusion with swagger) people are going to go for it. And yes twave has competitive viability, but so does swagger. Self swaggering may not be very relevant but it still exist and has been used in the past in tour environments. You can deal with swagger by switching out, and swagger can miss, which can't have the same thing said for twave, but idk why I care there are only 2 months of oras left anyway
Also for the record I'm not saying twave should be banned lol
 
Last edited:
I don't think I worded myself clearly. If people have an ring related wincon(whether it be an ice beam freeze, twave para or full confusion with swagger) people are going to go for it. And yes twave has competitive viability, but so does swagger. Self swaggering may not be very relevant but it still exist and has been used in the past in tour environments. You can deal with swagger by switching out, and swagger can miss, which can't have the same thing said for twave, but idk why I care there are only 2 months of oras left anyway
To me it comes down to "what does this move add to the metagame" and thunder wave does add speed control as its "primary" function. Swagger's primary function is to confuse the target which, while Self Swag has been used like once in the last year in a tournament (shoutouts Check), we saw so often people clicking Swagger to save them from bad matchups, losing situations and people using it as an alternative to taunt. To me Thunder Wave's addition to the metagame is substantial enough to look past the bullshit that it can cause.
 

ryo yamada2001

ryo yamada2001
is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
now that swagger was forcefully stuffed into satan's asshole and burned alive, can we do something about the 100 base power STAB feint that ignores subs glitch? i hear that one's quite the fucker
i don't really understand what the problem is in hoopa-unbounds case, it doesn't even get near as much usage as other top tier pokemon, it doesn't boast a crazy high win rate, and it's flaws are quite easily abused. you lose to a lot of physical attackers and it's speed tier makes it a difficult fit for most stuff apart from trick/semi-room teams. pair that with a quite shitty defensive typing (resisting literally nothing but psychic) and i don't think you've got a problematic pokemon honestly. it can be a very difficult pokemon to deal with when you're unprepared but quite honestly I feel like you should prepare for this thing regardless
 

Braverius

snowls
is a Past SPL Champion
i don't really understand what the problem is in hoopa-unbounds case, it doesn't even get near as much usage as other top tier pokemon, it doesn't boast a crazy high win rate, and it's flaws are quite easily abused. you lose to a lot of physical attackers and it's speed tier makes it a difficult fit for most stuff apart from trick/semi-room teams. pair that with a quite shitty defensive typing (resisting literally nothing but psychic) and i don't think you've got a problematic pokemon honestly. it can be a very difficult pokemon to deal with when you're unprepared but quite honestly I feel like you should prepare for this thing regardless
just made a megapost about this
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top