DiaWebs ft. Ghostceus
Hey all, S-Matrix here, on an account bearing my actual primary Showdown name. Some of you may know me from the Ubers room. I've only recently rejoined the Showdown scene this past week after an almost three year hiatus, and I'm coming to you with a team I made for my first laddering sessions, inspired and supplemented by a team you might recognize, from the mind of hyw.
Upon returning, I knew I wanted to build webs. I love the playstyle; it is at once both exhilarating in that it can fall apart with the smallest misplay, and also mindless when it is going right. I wanted to build with Diancie, since it checks so many of the problems web teams typically encounter. However, due to the nature of webs, this motivation was in fact misguided; by the time you get to "check" mons like Yveltal, Rayquaza or Ho-oh, those same mons can threaten a suicide defog or a setup, in the case of quaza. No, Diancie was to serve another purpose: preventing entry hazards from ending up on my side of the field, namely opposing webs, and to itself drop rocks. Along with this, and perhaps most importantly, it is meant to block defog by exploding. I was struggling with my building, and then I discovered that User hyw had already produced a team in this very same vein. I tried out the team, and of course it performed well, but it wasn't quite in line with my own preferred style of offensive play (read: mindless), and I wasn't a fan of the necessity of Lunala at certain junctures, since it is itself easy defog bait despite its nuke in Lunalium. With some slight edits made to better suit my tastes, I synthesized this edited version with some of my recent attempts at web squads, and with some advice from hyw and User RDKB, reached the current model.
I'm trying to get some fresh perspectives, see where it can be improved, etc. RMT stuff. Sorry I don't have a good song for you to listen to as you peruse this post, but my taste in music is pretty shit anyway, so you're not missing out on much, promise. Onto the squad:
Smeargle @ Focus Sash
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sticky Web
- Whirlwind
- Glare
- Taunt
The lead, unless I see a Gar, Diancie, Kanga or a DeoS. Web is web. Glare allows me to paralyze ground-types whereas nuzzle does not. Whirlwind lets me beat substitute leads. Taunt lets me stop webbed/glared defoggers and setup mons like Xern. EVs are pretty standard. DeoS beats us without mcoat, but Diancie can usually handle non-skill swap variants.
Yveltal @ Metronome
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Taunt
- Heat Wave
- Dark Pulse
- Oblivion Wing
Yveltal is almost a must-have for webs; beats Gar, breaks stallGira and Lugia, and absolutely chunks offensive mons in general. It's the hyw set, without disable. That decision is tentative, since disable is so utile against stall, but I do like heat wave, as it allows me to hit Magearna somewhat hard. The rest is standard Ygod. Sometimes I need to risk sac-ing it against Fairyceus or Xern who switch into DPulse, taunting to stop the defog or geomancy, which usually works out fine since Don can come in after and set up on them. EVs are standard. I like max speed so I can handle opposing Yveltal, and scarf Xerns at .67x speed who run defog, even if it means sac-ing.
Diancie-Mega @ Diancite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Explosion
- Diamond Storm
- Stealth Rock
- Moonblast
Anti-hazard, anti-birb, anti-party pooper. Diancie is a great webs breaker, and since its motivation is a suicide rocks, I can be pretty liberal with my use of it. Explosion gives me some good chip damage on webbed defoggers when it's time to block. DStorm hits Ho-oh, Lugia and... that's it. Moonblast hits everything else for a decent amount, usually hitting even Dusk-Mane for about a fourth of its health. SR is SR, "you drop em then you boom", in the words of Henri.
Kyogre @ Blue Orb
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Water Spout
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
THE BIG BOY/GIRL/WHALE. Kills Arceus-Ground, no questions asked, who would otherwise eat the team alive. Certain problems arise in trying to switch in to PDon after it comes in to take a water move, but usually something like Diancie or Smeargle is still around to sac, or yveltal can come in to take pblades or stomach an SE. RP don can be a problem for this strategy but hey, what team doesn't have flaws? Anyway, this thing SLAPS support Arc around, and hits everything hard as hell generally. Moveset is pretty standard. Fun fact, OPulse will kill any support Arc after an explosion from Diancie. Ok that isn't a fact but it sounds true, and appears to be from my own experience.
Arceus-Ghost @ Ghostium Z
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Force
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
The goat. This is my spinblocker, say something nice about it. His addition was suggested to me by Henri, where before I was running Arc-ground to better deal with PDon. SD turns Ghostceus into an absolute monster, allowing it to OHKO Lugia with Multiscale intact, using Neverending Nightmare. Really hates scarfveltal, but then, so do all webs teams (not a fan of Arc-dark either). Moveset is standard "fuck everything INCLUDING normal-types" set. The EVs were 40/252+/216 to creep Adamant MMence, but then decided, hey, no half-measures here, let's tie AdaMence no matter what. Might switch to Jolly depending on some calcs.
Groudon @ Red Orb
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance
- Rock Polish
- Precipice Blades
It another BIG BOY LOOK OUT. RP set on Webs??? You good??? Yeah I'm doing pretty well, ty for asking, and so is this set, so far. See, the thing is, speed control is hard to come by on webs, in a viable form. This don set not only gives you that control, but baits support Arc (aside from groundceus) into defogging (if its possible for them to do so) only to get RP'd on. Then, on the switch, I can SD and be set up for a sweep even without webs. I think the EVs could be tuned to account for this if you're feeling like it could be a consistent strategy, but exactly 252 Spe allows for outspeeding webbed Timid MMY, however important you consider that to be.
Threatlist:
Scarf birbs are annoying unless Diancie and Smeargle are both still around. They can both carry defog, the former usually does, and can threaten Arc-ghost despite its speed. Ho-oh defogging is Don setup bait tho, as is YGod, but against Ghostceus they force a switch.
Only a problem when it leads against me. The issue is the versatility; if it leads against me, it's hard to tell whether it's a defog set or whether someone just wants to espeed me. Usually it's the former, so it warrants a switch, but it can also set up and the team is weak to an already +2 EKiller. Sort of a problem with Smeargle Webs in general, if you aren't running something that can trade blows with it and come out on top.
Sash DeoA messes with Smeargle if it carries taunt, and has two lives, often chunking, if not killing something before dying. Yveltal can sometimes take it on but not reliably. Makes me want to run sucker punch on Ygod.
This thing is a big problem for the team, as it ignores webs, and is therefore faster than every mon on the team individually. On a team of setup mons, this thing can be annoying if Yveltal isn't still around, if it is, however, with the right predicts I can usually have it at a disadvantage.
As is kinda clear, scarfs really mess with this team. ScarfXern is no exception. Knock off on Ygod could help with this one in particular, since it likes to switch into it, but barring that, it makes for a mean suicide defogger.
+ Scarfed defogger
If rocks are gone, I can't set up, which kills a lot of this team's momentum. Also this thing chunks Arc-ghost for a ton with sneak.
In Closing:
You know the squad must be good when the threatlist is longer than the team. Thank you for any help in advance. Glad to be back playing again, the game is a lot of fun and so is the community. Thanks again to Henri, RDKB, for all their help drafting teams. They were both immensely helpful. Also ty to dewtios for passing me Henri's squad in the first place for me to learn from. It was like my second day back playing so it was much appreciated. Thanks for reading, let me know what you think.
P.S. There's a variation of the team I've been working on that uses Marshadium Marsgod to apply instant pressure where Arc-Ghost cannot, in the same vein as hyw's Lunala, except it can also outspeed and check threats like EKiller and weakened Yveltal without scarf. It also replaces Kyogre with Ekiller, which provides priority, and an end-game cleaner where Arc-Ghost once filled the role. So essentially, the roles just get traded around and the same pressure is generally kept, and it more closely resembles hyw's original squad. I may post it here as an alternative to the above for those who want to try it, and for review, since the only differences in composition and methodology have pretty much been outlined completely here.
Hey all, S-Matrix here, on an account bearing my actual primary Showdown name. Some of you may know me from the Ubers room. I've only recently rejoined the Showdown scene this past week after an almost three year hiatus, and I'm coming to you with a team I made for my first laddering sessions, inspired and supplemented by a team you might recognize, from the mind of hyw.
Upon returning, I knew I wanted to build webs. I love the playstyle; it is at once both exhilarating in that it can fall apart with the smallest misplay, and also mindless when it is going right. I wanted to build with Diancie, since it checks so many of the problems web teams typically encounter. However, due to the nature of webs, this motivation was in fact misguided; by the time you get to "check" mons like Yveltal, Rayquaza or Ho-oh, those same mons can threaten a suicide defog or a setup, in the case of quaza. No, Diancie was to serve another purpose: preventing entry hazards from ending up on my side of the field, namely opposing webs, and to itself drop rocks. Along with this, and perhaps most importantly, it is meant to block defog by exploding. I was struggling with my building, and then I discovered that User hyw had already produced a team in this very same vein. I tried out the team, and of course it performed well, but it wasn't quite in line with my own preferred style of offensive play (read: mindless), and I wasn't a fan of the necessity of Lunala at certain junctures, since it is itself easy defog bait despite its nuke in Lunalium. With some slight edits made to better suit my tastes, I synthesized this edited version with some of my recent attempts at web squads, and with some advice from hyw and User RDKB, reached the current model.
I'm trying to get some fresh perspectives, see where it can be improved, etc. RMT stuff. Sorry I don't have a good song for you to listen to as you peruse this post, but my taste in music is pretty shit anyway, so you're not missing out on much, promise. Onto the squad:
Smeargle @ Focus Sash
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sticky Web
- Whirlwind
- Glare
- Taunt
The lead, unless I see a Gar, Diancie, Kanga or a DeoS. Web is web. Glare allows me to paralyze ground-types whereas nuzzle does not. Whirlwind lets me beat substitute leads. Taunt lets me stop webbed/glared defoggers and setup mons like Xern. EVs are pretty standard. DeoS beats us without mcoat, but Diancie can usually handle non-skill swap variants.
Yveltal @ Metronome
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Taunt
- Heat Wave
- Dark Pulse
- Oblivion Wing
Yveltal is almost a must-have for webs; beats Gar, breaks stallGira and Lugia, and absolutely chunks offensive mons in general. It's the hyw set, without disable. That decision is tentative, since disable is so utile against stall, but I do like heat wave, as it allows me to hit Magearna somewhat hard. The rest is standard Ygod. Sometimes I need to risk sac-ing it against Fairyceus or Xern who switch into DPulse, taunting to stop the defog or geomancy, which usually works out fine since Don can come in after and set up on them. EVs are standard. I like max speed so I can handle opposing Yveltal, and scarf Xerns at .67x speed who run defog, even if it means sac-ing.
Diancie-Mega @ Diancite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Explosion
- Diamond Storm
- Stealth Rock
- Moonblast
Anti-hazard, anti-birb, anti-party pooper. Diancie is a great webs breaker, and since its motivation is a suicide rocks, I can be pretty liberal with my use of it. Explosion gives me some good chip damage on webbed defoggers when it's time to block. DStorm hits Ho-oh, Lugia and... that's it. Moonblast hits everything else for a decent amount, usually hitting even Dusk-Mane for about a fourth of its health. SR is SR, "you drop em then you boom", in the words of Henri.
Kyogre @ Blue Orb
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Water Spout
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
THE BIG BOY/GIRL/WHALE. Kills Arceus-Ground, no questions asked, who would otherwise eat the team alive. Certain problems arise in trying to switch in to PDon after it comes in to take a water move, but usually something like Diancie or Smeargle is still around to sac, or yveltal can come in to take pblades or stomach an SE. RP don can be a problem for this strategy but hey, what team doesn't have flaws? Anyway, this thing SLAPS support Arc around, and hits everything hard as hell generally. Moveset is pretty standard. Fun fact, OPulse will kill any support Arc after an explosion from Diancie. Ok that isn't a fact but it sounds true, and appears to be from my own experience.
Arceus-Ghost @ Ghostium Z
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Force
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
The goat. This is my spinblocker, say something nice about it. His addition was suggested to me by Henri, where before I was running Arc-ground to better deal with PDon. SD turns Ghostceus into an absolute monster, allowing it to OHKO Lugia with Multiscale intact, using Neverending Nightmare. Really hates scarfveltal, but then, so do all webs teams (not a fan of Arc-dark either). Moveset is standard "fuck everything INCLUDING normal-types" set. The EVs were 40/252+/216 to creep Adamant MMence, but then decided, hey, no half-measures here, let's tie AdaMence no matter what. Might switch to Jolly depending on some calcs.
Groudon @ Red Orb
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance
- Rock Polish
- Precipice Blades
It another BIG BOY LOOK OUT. RP set on Webs??? You good??? Yeah I'm doing pretty well, ty for asking, and so is this set, so far. See, the thing is, speed control is hard to come by on webs, in a viable form. This don set not only gives you that control, but baits support Arc (aside from groundceus) into defogging (if its possible for them to do so) only to get RP'd on. Then, on the switch, I can SD and be set up for a sweep even without webs. I think the EVs could be tuned to account for this if you're feeling like it could be a consistent strategy, but exactly 252 Spe allows for outspeeding webbed Timid MMY, however important you consider that to be.
Threatlist:
Scarf birbs are annoying unless Diancie and Smeargle are both still around. They can both carry defog, the former usually does, and can threaten Arc-ghost despite its speed. Ho-oh defogging is Don setup bait tho, as is YGod, but against Ghostceus they force a switch.
Only a problem when it leads against me. The issue is the versatility; if it leads against me, it's hard to tell whether it's a defog set or whether someone just wants to espeed me. Usually it's the former, so it warrants a switch, but it can also set up and the team is weak to an already +2 EKiller. Sort of a problem with Smeargle Webs in general, if you aren't running something that can trade blows with it and come out on top.
Sash DeoA messes with Smeargle if it carries taunt, and has two lives, often chunking, if not killing something before dying. Yveltal can sometimes take it on but not reliably. Makes me want to run sucker punch on Ygod.
This thing is a big problem for the team, as it ignores webs, and is therefore faster than every mon on the team individually. On a team of setup mons, this thing can be annoying if Yveltal isn't still around, if it is, however, with the right predicts I can usually have it at a disadvantage.
As is kinda clear, scarfs really mess with this team. ScarfXern is no exception. Knock off on Ygod could help with this one in particular, since it likes to switch into it, but barring that, it makes for a mean suicide defogger.
If rocks are gone, I can't set up, which kills a lot of this team's momentum. Also this thing chunks Arc-ghost for a ton with sneak.
In Closing:
You know the squad must be good when the threatlist is longer than the team. Thank you for any help in advance. Glad to be back playing again, the game is a lot of fun and so is the community. Thanks again to Henri, RDKB, for all their help drafting teams. They were both immensely helpful. Also ty to dewtios for passing me Henri's squad in the first place for me to learn from. It was like my second day back playing so it was much appreciated. Thanks for reading, let me know what you think.
Smeargle @ Focus Sash
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sticky Web
- Whirlwind
- Glare
- Taunt
Diancie-Mega @ Diancite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Explosion
- Diamond Storm
- Stealth Rock
- Moonblast
Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance
- Rock Polish
- Precipice Blades
Yveltal @ Metronome
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Taunt
- Heat Wave
- Dark Pulse
- Oblivion Wing
Arceus-Ghost @ Ghostium Z
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Force
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb
Ability: Primordial Sea
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Water Spout
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
Ability: Own Tempo
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sticky Web
- Whirlwind
- Glare
- Taunt
Diancie-Mega @ Diancite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Explosion
- Diamond Storm
- Stealth Rock
- Moonblast
Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance
- Rock Polish
- Precipice Blades
Yveltal @ Metronome
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Taunt
- Heat Wave
- Dark Pulse
- Oblivion Wing
Arceus-Ghost @ Ghostium Z
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Force
- Brick Break
- Stone Edge
Kyogre-Primal @ Blue Orb
Ability: Primordial Sea
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Water Spout
- Origin Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Thunder
P.S. There's a variation of the team I've been working on that uses Marshadium Marsgod to apply instant pressure where Arc-Ghost cannot, in the same vein as hyw's Lunala, except it can also outspeed and check threats like EKiller and weakened Yveltal without scarf. It also replaces Kyogre with Ekiller, which provides priority, and an end-game cleaner where Arc-Ghost once filled the role. So essentially, the roles just get traded around and the same pressure is generally kept, and it more closely resembles hyw's original squad. I may post it here as an alternative to the above for those who want to try it, and for review, since the only differences in composition and methodology have pretty much been outlined completely here.
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