Conkeldurr[DONE :]]




[Pros]

<ul>
<li>It has good physical bulk, allowing it to switch into physical threats such as Tyranitar.</li>
<li>It has amazing base 140 Attack.</li>
<li>Two great abilities in Guts and Iron Fist are at its disposal.</li>
<li>Access to Bulk Up makes it quite good as a setup sweeper.</li>
</ul>

[Cons]

<ul>
<li>While it is quite bulky when invested, threats such as Azumarill, Florges, Togekiss, and Talonflame can severely hurt it.</li>
<li>Horrible Speed means that it has to take an attack before being able to retaliate.</li>
<li>It receives competition from other Fighting-types such as Mega Heracross and Lucario.</li>

[Set Recommendations]
name: Bulk Up
move 1: Drain Punch
move 2: Bulk Up
move 3: Stone Edge / Poison Jab
move 4: Payback
item: Leftovers
ability: Iron Fist / Guts
Adamant Nature
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpD

<p>This is the best set Conkeldurr can run without access to the elemental punches. With good physical bulk and access to Bulk Up, Conkeldurr can set up in the face of physical attackers and after a boost or two, it becomes a threat to contend with. Drain Punch is the STAB move of choice and deals good damage while giving Conkeldurr semi-reliable recovery. Stone Edge is the primary slash in the third moveslot as it lets Conkeldurr hit Talonflame, Gyarados, and Mega Charizard, three great threats to it, hard. Alternatively, Poison Jab hits Fairy-type Pokemon such as Florges, Azumarill, and Togekiss for good damage, which is important as otherwise they would wall this set. Payback is a very useful move for Conkeldurr, letting it hit Ghost- and Psychic-type Pokemon such as Gengar, Alakazam, Trevenant, and Aegislash, the latter being doubly important as it is otherwise a major roadblock to Conkeldurr, being able to set up Swords Dance and eventually break through it.</p>

<p>Good partners include those that can defeat the Psychic-, Flying-, and Fairy-type threats that Conkeldurr despises; despite it having the appropriate coverage move for each, all of these threats can outspeed and threaten to OHKO. These partners include Steel-types such as Ferrothorn and Scizor that can deal with these threats. While the sand Tyranitar brings wears Conkeldurr down, it is a great partner that can deal with most of these threats, being able to Pursuit trap the previously mentioned Ghost- and Psychic-types. Aegislash can revenge kill these Pokemon with STAB Shadow Sneak, and can also set up on some of these counters with Swords Dance. An alternate spread of 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD can be used to provide extra survivability, but the power drop is significant.</p>

[Checks and Counters]

<p>Among the foremost in the counters to Conkeldurr is Reuniclus; it can take even boosted Paybacks whilst underspeeding it and can OHKO with Psychic. Slowbro and Slowking are in a similar boat&mdash;Psychic variants of the former can 2HKO it, while both naturally underspeed, thus not boosting Payback's power&mdash;and the latter can simply phaze out Conkeldurr. Although Slowking's physical bulk is relatively poor, both can recover any health lost by means of Slack Off or Regenerator. Togekiss, Azumarill, Florges, and Sylveon can quickly put an end to Conkeldurr with their Fairy-type STAB move of choice, but must watch out for a super effective Poison Jab. SubToxic Gliscor is an excellent counter, being able to status and stall out even Guts variants with Substitute and Protect. Skarmory can stomach even boosted hits and either phaze it out or hit it with a super effective STAB Brave Bird. Talonflame can strike Conkeldurr with a priority Brave Bird before it can blink. Crobat only fears Stone Edge, and even then, Stone Edge only hits it neutrally while Roosting, while in return it can hammer Conkeldurr with Brave Bird. Hawlucha resists Drain Punch and Payback and is only hit neutrally by Stone Edge, while KOing with a Flying STAB move of choice. Trevenant and Geourgiest can deal with Conkeldurr fairly well due to Will-O-Wisp, but Guts variants can turn the tables on both and proceed to OHKO with a Guts-boosted Payback; Payback from non-Guts variants will hurt as well even after a burn.</p>
 
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Alter

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(not qc but I'd like to comment)

I think the Sheer Force Life Orb set of BW2 was Conkeldurr's best available moveset and should therefore go first. I'd structure it like so:

<p>Conkeldurr @ Life Orb<br />
Ability: Sheer Force<br />
EVs: 120 HP / 252 Atk / 116 SpD / 20 Spe<br />
Adamant Nature<br />
- Drain Punch / Hammer Arm<br />
- Thunder Punch<br />
- Ice Punch<br />
- Mach Punch / Fire Punch</p>

Then in the comments I'd mention the same set for Trick Room but with Hammer Arm being used over Drain Punch and minimized Speed EVs / IVs. This set is quite the monster and I used it in pretty much every OTR team that I used. The main reason why it is so good is because it is extremely hard to switch in to. Typical physical walls that would wall other Conkeldurr sets take massive damage from the boosted elemental punches. This means that Skarmory, Jellicent, Landorus-Therian, Gliscor, etc. are never are issue and all Trick Room turns are used to maximum efficiency. Obviously you could remove Hammer Arm as a slash and just keep it in the comments relating to Conk being used under Trick Room. I personally think that Iron Fist isn't really that great on this set because Sheer Force not only removes recoil from the elemental punches but also boosts them drastically.

If you plan on adding a Bulk Up set, I'd go for maximum special def/atk (the bw2 one; same moves probably), Guts, an Adamant nature all with Leftovers. I am unsure how effective this Conkeldurr set is or will be this generation, though. Good luck with your analysis. Conkeldurr is an awesome Pokemon.


edit: nvm i'm ridiculously stupid and thought the elemental punches were egg moves alongside Drain Punch
 
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Colonel M

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Unless it has changed in Generation 6, the elemental punches are unobtainable for Conkeldurr at this time.
 
Sorry, i would like to give you some suggestion about Conkeldurr for your analysis (I'm not QC too).
I've tried it with Assault Vest and Payback and I've found out a suitable check to Mega-Gengar!

I've used this set:

Conkeldurr @ Assault Vest
Ability: Iron Fist
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Stone Edge
- Mach Punch
- Payback

This is an all-out attacker with a great defensive potential. The only drawback is its burn/poison weakness, so you need a Cleric for it (Iron Fist > Guts in this set 'cause you need immediate power).
The only thing that destroy this set is King's Shield Aegislash.
 
Due to the lack of elemental punches (which is one of the main reasons that Conkeldurr in bw2 was such a threat), there is little reason to choose this Pokemon over other Fighting-types (MegaLucario who boasts better Speed, SD, Better STAB attacks - Breloom who got Spore, better use of its priority and also has a Rock-type move which lowers Speed - MegaHeracross who is a better wallbreaker currently due to lack of elemental punches on Conk's end and better movepool - Chesnaught acts as a better physical tank and can set up Spikes as well). this Pokemon gets Payback which is huge therefore...

The only set this thing should be using is one that takes advantage of its good natural bulk and use a Bulk Up set; something which the other Fighting-types don't do as well...

Conkeldurr @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Fist / Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Sp.Def
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Bulk Up
- Stone Edge / Poison Jab
- Payback

This is what I strongly believe Conk should be running, there is no reason to run an Assault vest set which a)makes you only use your medicore choice of attacking moves 2) No power up or recovery moves.

For anyone that thinks that missing Mach punch is such a big deal

1)Too many new Pokemon either resist this or are immune to it.

2)Takes up a valuable move slot and you NEED a move to hit Fairy-types either neutrally or Super Effective.

3)Conk is bulky, if you want to use Mach Punch you might as well run Life Orb and there are better Pokemon suited to that position.

A LO TR set is not worth it currently also. I don't know if Poison Jab is available for this Pokemon to learn this generation, if it is, it is worth looking into as well. This is simply due to the fatc that you wreck Fairy-types with a SE hit that can also poison, which is nice. The only Fairy-type who Stone Edge will hit alot harder is Stone Edge, but that misses alot and has poor PP. Togekiss outspeeds and beats you with its Serence Grace Air Slashes anyways I will let the other QC weigh in their opinions.
 
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alexwolf

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<li>Awesome physical bulk, allowing it to take most physical hits such as Lucario's Close Combat.</li>
Tone this down as without any investment Conkeldurr won't be switching into any strong physical hit that it doesn't resist. Mentioning that it can take a Lucario's Close Combat is irrelevant as Lucario would never stay in unboosted against it and at +2 Conkeldurr is OHKOed. Just mention that it has good physical bulk that lets it switch in against x,y, and z threats.

<li>It has access to a nice array of coverage moves.</li>
Coverage is definitely not one of Conkeldurr's pros atm. It barely has the absolute minimum of a necessary movepool to function so remove this line.

<li>Three great abilities in Guts, Iron Fist, and Sheer Force are at its disposal.</li>
Remove the mention of Sheer Force as it is irrelevant without access to the elemental punches.

<li>Access to STAB priority makes it a good revenge killer in situations.</li>
You don't have Mach Punch on the main set so remove this.

<li>Access to Trick Room makes it quite good as a setup sweeper.</li>
Reword this as the way it is now makes it sound as if Conkeldurr gets Trick Room, which it doesn't. Just mention that it's a decent option for Trick Room teams.

Add Bulk Up to its advantages, the main reason to use Conkeldurr right now.

<li>It has poor special bulk; it gets KOed by almost every decently powered special attack.</li>
This is an exaggeration. Conkeldurr has decent natural special bulk and with max SpD investment it can take a lot of punishment from special attackers. I would replace this line with something like this: ''Conkeldurr is weak to Flying and Fairy moves, moves carried by common Pokemon such as Talonflame, Azumarill, Togekiss, Sylveon, and Florges''.

Tone down any mention of Conkeldurr's physical bulk as awesome throughout the preview, it is just great.

volc can take most hits aside from stone edge and can OHKO with a hurricane in rain or a sun-boosted fire blast, hits its lower spdef stat
Remove this, as Stone Edge is a main slash on Conk's moveset and rain and sun are not common at all, and Hurricane Volcarona is not a thing anymore.

Add as checks Togekiss, Azumarill, Florges, and Sylveon, all Pokemon that outspeed it, resist its STAB move, and can either deal a ton of damage back or straight up OHKO it.

After you do those i will give you my stamp.
 

alexwolf

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Oh and also replace the mentions of Breloom with a more relevant Pokemon, such as Mega Heracross.

Also you didn't add those:

volc can take most hits aside from stone edge and can OHKO with a hurricane in rain or a sun-boosted fire blast, hits its lower spdef stat
Remove this, as Stone Edge is a main slash on Conk's moveset and rain and sun are not common at all, and Hurricane Volcarona is not a thing anymore.

Add as checks Togekiss, Azumarill, Florges, and Sylveon, all Pokemon that outspeed it, resist its STAB move, and can either deal a ton of damage back or straight up OHKO it.
And add a few teammates.
 

Reymedy

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Wouldn't it be relevant to mention a Status Orb Guts set with 4 attacks ?
I know that a lot of people are looking at Conkeldurr as one of the best TR sweeper, and this set, since it packs immediate power (you usually don't want to use a turn of Trick Room to Bulk Up) is the best solution right now.
On top of that, you don't have to run any sub-par coverage move to hit Fairies hard enough, since Facade hits most Fairies like a truck (but the Steel/Fairy pokemons, which are Neutral to Fighting).

I believe that set was removed from the 5th gen analysis because the Sheer Force set was outclassing it (out of the status absorbing power). But since that set isn't available in gen 6 yet, it makes the Status Orb set relevant for a couple of weeks.
I'm pretty sure you'd just have to copy pasta it from some old analysis, and delete it if needed once the Sheer Force set gets available.

My two cents, I may be missing something.

PS : The EVs spread is weird, you shouldn't put everything in SpD and let HP uninvested.
 
The above:
Conk basically only gets dpunch stone edge payback and facade. Idk about using these coverage moves especially under tr since it gets badly cockblocked by aegislash, and its checks still check it. But thats for qc to decide.
I'm quite iffy about the spread too, and will look for a better one asap.
 

Alter

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I'd like to expand on what Remedy has said and mention that Guts should have the main slash over Iron Fist on the current Bulk Up set. While boosting Drain Punch is pretty nice, I think that effects of Guts are too much to pass up on a boosting set. Conkeldurr becomes a killing machine after a burn/poison and having only one 'punching move' doesn't warrant Iron Fist to be a primary option. Just my $0.02.
 

Reymedy

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The above:
Conk basically only gets dpunch stone edge payback and facade. Idk about using these coverage moves especially under tr since it gets badly cockblocked by aegislash, and its checks still check it. But thats for qc to decide.
I'm quite iffy about the spread too, and will look for a better one asap.
I don't understand which point you're trying to make.
Aegislash doesn't care about the BU set either, you'd need to win a ton of "50/50" to beat it. It can ignore any attack with King's Shield, and deal okay damage by ignoring your boosts with Sacred Sword.
 
SOMALIA
Is the current spread fine, or should i make it 252 HP(i think hp+spdef investment+252 atk would be best)
Until then, not sending to gp ^_^
 
I ran some calcs and as far as common physical hits are concerned, there is no major difference to warrant any HP Evs to be used. In contrast, when the HP and Sp.Def EVs are divided you take hits alot worse form special threats. Max Attack and Special Defense is the way to go. Another important reason to avoid adding HP Evs is to ensure you make the most of the recovery from Drain Punch. Last but not least please mention additional comments that you can also run a spread of 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD to add to the overall bulk at the cost of lowering your attack..but regardless with Bulk Up and good natural Attack, it is still viable.
 

GatoDelFuego

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Kingler12345

REMOVE CHANGE COMMENTS

[Pros]

<ul>
<li>It has good physical bulk, allowing it to switch into physical threats such as Tyranitar.</li>
<li>It has amazing base 140 Attack.</li>
<li>Two great abilities in Guts and Iron Fist are at its disposal.</li>
<li>Access to Bulk Up makes it quite good as a setup sweeper.</li>
</ul>

[Cons]

<ul>
<li>While it is quite bulky when invested, threats such as Azumarill, Florges, Togekiss, and Talonflame can severely hurt it.</li>
<li>Horrible Speed means that it has to take an attack before being able to retaliate.</li>
<li>It receives competition from other Fighting-types such as Mega Heracross and Lucario.</li>

[Set Recommendations]

<p>Conkeldurr @ Leftovers<br />
Ability: Iron Fist / Guts<br />
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpD<br />
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)<br />
- Drain Punch<br />
- Bulk Up<br />
- Stone Edge / Poison Jab<br />
- Payback</p>
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<p>This is the best set Conkeldurr can run without access to the elemental punches. With good physical bulk and access to Bulk Up, Conkeldurr can set up in the face of physical attackers and after a boost or two, it becomes a threat to contend with. Drain Punch is the STAB move of choice and deals good damage while giving Conkeldurr semi-reliable recovery. Stone Edge is the primary slash in the third moveslot three as it lets Conkeldurr hit Talonflame, Gyarados, and Mega Charizard, three great threats to it, hard. Alternatively, Poison Jab hits Fairy-type Pokemon such as Florges, Azumarill, and Togekiss for good damage, which is important as otherwise they would wall this set. Payback is a very useful move for Conkeldurr, letting it hit Ghost- and Psychic-type Pokemon such as Gengar, Alakazam, Trevenant, and Aegislash, the latter being doubly important as it is otherwise a major roadblock to Conkeldurr, being able to set up Swords Dance and eventually break through it.</p>

<p>Good partners include those which that can defeat the Psychic-, Flying-, and Fairy-type threats that Conkeldurr despises; despite it having the appropriate coverage move for each, all of these threats can outspeed and threaten to OHKO. These partners include Steel-types such as Ferrothorn and Scizor that can deal with these threats. While the sand Tyranitar brings wears Conkeldurr down, it is a great partner that can deal with most of these threats, being able to Pursuit trap the previously mentioned Ghost- and Psychic-types. Aegislash can revenge kill these Pokemon with STAB Shadow Sneak, and can also set up on some of these counters with Swords Dance. An alternate spread of 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD can be used to provide extra survivability, (AC) but the power drop is significant.</p>

[Checks and Counters]

<p>Among the foremost in the counters to Conkeldurr is Reuniclus; it can take even boosted Paybacks whilst underspeeding it, (RC) and can quickly OHKO with Psychic. Slowbro and Slowking are in a similar boat&mdash;Psychic variants of the former can 2HKO it, while both naturally underspeed, thus not boosting Payback's power&mdash;and the latter can simply phaze out Conkeldurr. (period) Although its their physical bulk is relatively poor, and both can recover any health lost by means of Slack Off or Regenerator. Togekiss, Azumarill, Florges, and Sylveon can quickly put an end to its shenanigans Conkeldurr with their Fairy-type STAB move of choice, but must watch out for a super effective Poison Jab. SubToxic Gliscor is an excellent counter, being able to status and stall out even Guts variants with Substitute and Protect. Skarmory can stomach even boosted hits and either phaze it out or hit it with a super effective STAB Brave Bird. Talonflame can strike Conkeldurr with a priority Brave Bird before it can blink. Crobat only fears Stone Edge, and even then, Stone Edge only hits it neutrally while Roosting, while in return it can hammer Conkeldurr with Brave Bird. Hawlucha resists Drain Punch and Payback and is only hit neutrally by Stone Edge, while KOing with a Flying STAB of choice. Trevenant and Geourgiest can deal with Conkeldurr fairly well due to Will-O-Wisp, but Guts variants can turn the tables on both and proceed to OHKO with a Guts-boosted Payback; Payback from non-Guts variants will hurt as well even after a burn.</p>

1/1
 
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Post-Bank, there's no set I prefer to Assault Vest with Knock Off and Ice Punch as coverage. With full HP and Attack investment the thing's a friggin monster. Think LO Sheer Force Landorus Psychic failing to OHKO.

(Why are we not just doing this after the 27th?)
 

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