Pokémon Alolan Muk

[Salmando]

Muk has become my new vaporion, with a slight change.

Previously I ran a wish, toxic, acid armour, protect vaporion which was easy to setup, and extremely hard to kill. Taunt would shut it down completely, and steel types obviously ended up being part of a pp contest.

With muk, I do similar but it's so far much more effective.

Black sludge
Poison touch

Poison fang - this move replaces toxic, does damage, and prevents taunt from being an issue. I don't know the numbers, but this feels like a near 50% chance to badly poison. When it does fail, it's quite rare that poison touch doesn't kick in. I got 8 out of 10 attacks resulting in poison.

Protect - aid in recovery

Minimize - the bread and butter. Many people underestimate muk, often thinking they can get a setup move before attacking. Once you got 3 minimises (very easy) muk becomes extremely frustrating to hit. Combined with the passive recovery and protect to be sure, I very rarely lose my muk once it's evasiveness is full.

Flamethrower - not overly hard hitting, but deals with steel types very nicely.

Loving this muk

 

[EyedMoon]

Minimize

Check the website you're posting on please
Or maybe this post on page 3 of this very thread

 

[Steel With It]

Well anyways, in order to follow this build, how would one go about getting a Muk with Pursuit who only has Sun and Moon? I'm assuming there isn't a way other than trading?

Bank's finally up and I've already started breeding Pursuit Grimers, if you're still looking for one.

 

[RainbowDemon]

I wonder if Shadow Sneak is that good of a move in A-Muk. If you haven't got any other kind of priority for revenge killing I suppose it's OK, otherwise it's just a very weak move that's only effective against shit that's already weak against his STABs.
I had an idea on a Curse set for him actually. He loses immediate special bulk but his defenses are still good enough to tank some hits, and damaged gets partially compensation from Black Sludge.
It's also important that he can actually invalidate some of his walls, such as Mega Venusaur, because he can set up on them. So, if the opponent decides to wall your Muk, you have a great chance of boosting to +2 just like that.

Muk-Alola @ Black Sludge
Ability: Poison Touch
EVs: 252 HP / 168 Def / 88 SpD
Careful Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Knock Off
- Brick Break
- Curse

This set makes Muk-A more of a threat, since he can set up on a lot of mons and is harder to set up into. I don't think it's very good on it's own, but I've made it with grassy terrain in mind.
In grassy terrain, Muk-A loses every weakness except for Earth Power and a few unusual ground moves, and gets much appreciated additional recovery alongside Black Sludge.
At +1, the opponent might find hard to pressure Muk since switching into Tapus to break grassy terrain is a big nope. Gunk Shot and Knock Off cause heavy damage out of a boosted 369 attack, with a 30% chance of inflicting poison.
As you can see from the calcs below, +1 Atk / +1 Def Muk-A @ Black Sludge in Grassy Terrain is a real pain in the ass.

*Here are some calcs to show how threatening +1 Muk-A attacks are:

+1 0 Atk Muk-Alola Knock Off vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Metagross-Mega: 152-182 (50.4 - 60.4%) -- 89.8% chance to 2HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery

+1 0 Atk Muk-Alola Brick Break vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Heatran: 160-190 (49.5 - 58.8%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO

+1 0 Atk Muk-Alola Gunk Shot vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Gyarados-Mega: 186-220 (56.1 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery

+1 0 Atk Muk-Alola Gunk Shot vs. 0 HP / 192 Def Tapu Fini: 306-360 (108.8 - 128.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

*Turns out, his special bulk is great even without Assault Vest:

252 SpA Heatran Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 168+ SpD Muk-Alola: 152-180 (36.7 - 43.4%) -- 14.8% chance to 3HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252 SpA Charizard-Mega-Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 168+ SpD Muk-Alola: 244-288 (58.9 - 69.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252 SpA Life Orb Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 168+ SpD Muk-Alola: 214-253 (51.6 - 61.1%)

252+ SpA Choice Specs Greninja-Ash Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 168+ SpD Muk-Alola: 259-306 (62.5 - 73.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

*And he gets tough physically after a single boost as well. In grassy terrain, some huge threats are invalidated:

252 Atk Landorus-Therian Earthquake vs. +1 252 HP / 88 Def Muk-Alola: 134-162 (32.3 - 39.1%) -- 96.6% chance to 4HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252 Atk Tough Claws Charizard-Mega-X Flare Blitz vs. +1 252 HP / 88 Def Muk-Alola: 193-228 (46.6 - 55%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252 Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. +1 252 HP / 88 Def Muk-Alola: 168-198 (40.5 - 47.8%) -- 98.5% chance to 3HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252 Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Meteor Mash vs. +1 252 HP / 88 Def Muk-Alola: 157-186 (37.9 - 44.9%) -- 49.9% chance to 3HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

Next, some annoying mons that'll have to be removed before Muk-A can perform (a powerful fire mon might do the job):

Mega Sableye: impossible to set up on because Will-O-Wisp.
Skarmory and Celesteela: broken defensive typing. Skarm can also phaze it.
Bulky Mega Scizor: even though boosted Muk-A can hurt it, it's likely it'll overwhelm Muk-A with Swords Dance + Roost.
Toxapex: Haze user. Switching to Bulu can put pressure on the opposing team.
Rotom-W: shit burns Muk-A.

What do you think?

 

[GOthee]

I wonder if Shadow Sneak is that good of a move in A-Muk. If you haven't got any other kind of priority for revenge killing I suppose it's OK, otherwise it's just a very weak move that's only effective against shit that's already weak against his STABs.
I had an idea on a Curse set for him actually. He loses immediate special bulk but his defenses are still good enough to tank some hits, and damaged gets partially compensation from Black Sludge.
It's also important that he can actually invalidate some of his walls, such as Mega Venusaur, because he can set up on them. So, if the opponent decides to wall your Muk, you have a great chance of boosting to +2 just like that.

Muk-Alola @ Black Sludge
Ability: Poison Touch
EVs: 252 HP / 168 Def / 88 SpD
Careful Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Knock Off
- Brick Break
- Curse

This set makes Muk-A more of a threat, since he can set up on a lot of mons and is harder to set up into. I don't think it's very good on it's own, but I've made it with grassy terrain in mind.
In grassy terrain, Muk-A loses every weakness except for Earth Power and a few unusual ground moves, and gets much appreciated additional recovery alongside Black Sludge.
At +1, the opponent might find hard to pressure Muk since switching into Tapus to break grassy terrain is a big nope. Gunk Shot and Knock Off cause heavy damage out of a boosted 369 attack, with a 30% chance of inflicting poison.
As you can see from the calcs below, +1 Atk / +1 Def Muk-A @ Black Sludge in Grassy Terrain is a real pain in the ass.

*Here are some calcs to show how threatening +1 Muk-A attacks are:

+1 0 Atk Muk-Alola Knock Off vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Metagross-Mega: 152-182 (50.4 - 60.4%) -- 89.8% chance to 2HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery

+1 0 Atk Muk-Alola Brick Break vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Heatran: 160-190 (49.5 - 58.8%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO

+1 0 Atk Muk-Alola Gunk Shot vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Gyarados-Mega: 186-220 (56.1 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Grassy Terrain recovery

+1 0 Atk Muk-Alola Gunk Shot vs. 0 HP / 192 Def Tapu Fini: 306-360 (108.8 - 128.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

*Turns out, his special bulk is great even without Assault Vest:

252 SpA Heatran Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 168+ SpD Muk-Alola: 152-180 (36.7 - 43.4%) -- 14.8% chance to 3HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252 SpA Charizard-Mega-Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 168+ SpD Muk-Alola: 244-288 (58.9 - 69.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252 SpA Life Orb Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 168+ SpD Muk-Alola: 214-253 (51.6 - 61.1%)

252+ SpA Choice Specs Greninja-Ash Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 168+ SpD Muk-Alola: 259-306 (62.5 - 73.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

*And he gets tough physically after a single boost as well. In grassy terrain, some huge threats are invalidated:

252 Atk Landorus-Therian Earthquake vs. +1 252 HP / 88 Def Muk-Alola: 134-162 (32.3 - 39.1%) -- 96.6% chance to 4HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252 Atk Tough Claws Charizard-Mega-X Flare Blitz vs. +1 252 HP / 88 Def Muk-Alola: 193-228 (46.6 - 55%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252 Atk Pheromosa High Jump Kick vs. +1 252 HP / 88 Def Muk-Alola: 168-198 (40.5 - 47.8%) -- 98.5% chance to 3HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

252 Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Meteor Mash vs. +1 252 HP / 88 Def Muk-Alola: 157-186 (37.9 - 44.9%) -- 49.9% chance to 3HKO after Black Sludge recovery and Grassy Terrain recovery

Next, some annoying mons that'll have to be removed before Muk-A can perform (a powerful fire mon might do the job):

Mega Sableye: impossible to set up on because Will-O-Wisp.
Skarmory and Celesteela: broken defensive typing. Skarm can also phaze it.
Bulky Mega Scizor: even though boosted Muk-A can hurt it, it's likely it'll overwhelm Muk-A with Swords Dance + Roost.
Toxapex: Haze user. Switching to Bulu can put pressure on the opposing team.
Rotom-W: shit burns Muk-A.

What do you think?

ISnt max Atk adamant max Hp with shadow sneak instead of brick break better?

 

[RainbowDemon]

ISnt max Atk adamant max Hp with shadow sneak instead of brick break better?

I guess it depends on what your team needs. Shadow Sneak has its uses but it makes Muk lose a lot of power against Normal, Rock, Steel and Dark mons. Ghost is only good against Ghost and Psychic, and for those mons there's Knock Off.
Max Atk Adamant is a choice, but it makes this set prone to a lot of 2HKOs. I think tweaking some EVs to Atk might be enough to catch some important OHKOs/2HKOS.

 

[nameless90]

While it seems underwhelming at a first glance, Screech is very useful on A-Muk.
It is useful to weaken the opposite switch-ins to the point Poison/Dark coverage is enough.
Pursuit has a natural synergy with Screech forcing switch-ins and ensuring some KOs towards key threats.
The best part is that A-Muk is so slow that is forced out easily anyway towards many Earthquake users, so the Curse boosts are wasted, whereas Screech's effect lasts even if you switch out A-Muk. With this move you get rid of most Muk's checks bar Bisharp.

 

[christopher_ 1942]

I was thinking of trying out Alolan Muk as it is a good wall breaker thanks to Knock Off. Would Haze be good on this Pokemon as well to prevent certain sweepers?

 

[Invers10n]

I was thinking of trying out Alolan Muk as it is a good wall breaker thanks to Knock Off. Would Haze be good on this Pokemon as well to prevent certain sweepers?

It would need to be Clear Smog, as Alolan Muk doesn't get Haze. This would, of course, allow steel types to set up on it without being hazed.

 

[Patrick1088]

It would need to be Clear Smog, as Alolan Muk doesn't get Haze. This would, of course, allow steel types to set up on it without being hazed.

What steel types set up in UU? SD Bisharp and Cobalion are the only ones coming to mind...

 

[Revelation]

What steel types set up in UU? SD Bisharp and Cobalion are the only ones coming to mind...

Celesteela and Magearna are a couple more. Autotomize/Shift Gear and Beast Boost/Soul-Heart.

 

[readytolose]

Celesteela and Magearna are a couple more. Autotomize/Shift Gear and Beast Boost/Soul-Heart.

We're talking about UU, not OU. Anyways, you can add Scizor and Lucario to that list.

 

[Invers10n]

What steel types set up in UU? SD Bisharp and Cobalion are the only ones coming to mind...

Cobalion didn't occur to me, but yeah I was thinking Bisharp, Scizor, Lucario, Aggron, Doublade. Bonus points on Aggron for taking pitiful Knock Off damage if mega.

 

[Sulfurian]

So is A-muk doing well in OU? I'm kinda shocked he's still around. Or is it more like "eh he's a fan favorite" kinda deals?

 

[pika pal]

Alolan Muk is a niche pick that performs his niche very well, as his bulk, typing, and ability let him play a very effective answer to Fairies, Psychic types, and less powerful special attackers, particularly teams built around Tapu Lele. Pursuit trapping, Poison touch, STAB Knock Off, and good special bulk do give him a unique position, which his C+ reflects well: his role isn't a commonly needed one, but he performs well if called for.

 

[Oathkeeper]

I was thinking about this set in mind:

Item: Black Sludge
Ability: Poison Touch
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Def
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Gunk Shot
- Shadow Sneak
- Curse

This set is for bulk and offense! While Muk-A's only weakness is Ground, it really has nothing to beat it. So, with that in mind, the Curse + 3 Attacks set works rather nicely. The nature and EV spread max out it's bulk and SpDef. Knowing it's speed is low and will continue to get low with Curse, Shadow Sneak helps out greatly once the Normal-types are gone. Knock Off and Gunk being it's two strong STABs. You could forego SS or KO for Crunch for some extra pop. Shadow Sneak also helps with that Poison Touch.

 

[Sun King]

Okay, so since Dugtrio is (based on my perception of the suspect thread) likely getting the ban, I want to start some discussion about this guy as a replacement for Duggy on stall. What sets are y'all finding most effective?

 

[AM]

Okay, so since Dugtrio is (based on my perception of the suspect thread) likely getting the ban, I want to start some discussion about this guy as a replacement for Duggy on stall. What sets are y'all finding most effective?

AV. No legitimate reason to use other sets.

 

[Sun King]

AV. No legitimate reason to use other sets.

Right, I meant more so what EVs are we running? Are we min/maxing or are there important benchmarks to hit with Attack and PDef?

 

[Dakress]

Right, I meant more so what EVs are we running? Are we min/maxing or are there important benchmarks to hit with Attack and PDef?

The standard spread is maxing HP and Attack with an Adamant nature. The idea is to switch into a special attacker like Lele, sponge a hit and then go for a strong Pursuit (which can 2KO lele btw), or Knock Off to cripple/scout whatever poke switches in. A similar spread is 252 HP / 212 Atk / 4 Def / 40 SpD, which trades some power for more special defense.

 

[AM]

Why would you run so much attack investment on stall though? Especially when its going to need all the investment in bulk to keep specs Tapu Lele, the strongest variant that threatens the stall archetype, at bay / remove in the long run.

Max SpDef w/ and w/o rocks

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Muk-Alola: 123-145 (29.7 - 35%) -- 17.3% chance to 3HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Muk-Alola: 123-145 (29.7 - 35%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock

Standard w/ and w/o rocks

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 16 SpD Assault Vest Muk-Alola: 169-199 (40.8 - 48%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Lele Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 16 SpD Assault Vest Muk-Alola: 169-199 (40.8 - 48%) -- 62.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

A-Muk is being supplemented by Wish support in most cases to begin with and as far as its role on stall I don't see the necessity to run all that attack investment and from games I've seen and played on the suspect ladder with A-Muks being used on stall they're going for bulk.